Problems I'm having with the loyalist titan:

1.  The weapons targeting with the titan is fubar.  Even if you tell the titan to attack one ship it continues to attack all the ships around it.  Seems to me if you explicitly give it a target it should devote all appropriate, target-able weapons on that ship until you change the order.  1 Capital ship + 10 frigates closely grouped together nearly took out my titan because it kept spreading the fire around and not aiming just at the capital ship as I kept telling it to...so even though the frigates couldnt really hurt it, it wouldnt go after the one ship that could!  I've seen this problem with the cap ships too but to a lesser extent

2.  Have the loyalist titan be able to build all ship types!  I like the story line with the loyalist being on the move but they dont have a mobile ship building option. This would create a lot of interesting strategic issues with the titan

3.  As everyone has mentioned the loyalist titan is way under-powered for late-game play....

as i mentioned in another thread it has two main problems right now.

1. Poor DPS - The Phase cannon is pretty weak and the wave cannons don't scale with research

2. Phase Stabilizer - Cooldown is too long at the moment needs to be shortened.

By the way, I've mentioned this in another thread, but I figured I'd mention it here too, when both are maxed, the Vorastra willl lose to the Coronata 1v1.  Even after changing Pulse Waves to Wave Cannons, buffing them, and compensation-nerfing the Phase Cannons because I made them deal damage directly to hull, microing incessantly to take advantage of the lack of side guns on the Coronata, the Coronata wtill survived with most of it's shields left.

Also, as I'm working on the Rebellion version of RR, the way I elected to change the Vorastra was by first causing Pulse Waves to be affected by Wave Cannon research, reducing the cooldown at all levels of SPS by 100 seconds, and reducing the effect of desperation, but increasing it's duration and increasing the cap, allowing you to ultimately achieve more when facing larger fleets.  Last, I made MPJ give the Vorastra an 8/10/12/14 second rotational boost.

We'll see how this causes it to handle...

1. I believe you're mistaken.  Starbases and titans have multiple targets per bank (in the case of the Vorastra, 4 forward, 2 port, 2 starboard, 1 aft IIRC), so what you're reporting is probably just this.  It does not reduce the damage listed.  You see, multiple bank targets means that the listed DPS is given to each enemy it attacks and does not split it up between targets; each target receives full damage.

2. I disagree.  It can SPS which gives you the ability to spawn small fleets of whatever type you want.

Volt, have you thought at all about just increasing the damage resistance passive of Desperation? To me the biggest problem with the Vorastra is that it is supposed to replace your capital planet and thus keep you from losing the game but is in fact mightily squishy. Giving the Desperation passive an extra 3% per level or so would at least help with this.

What about making the passive damage reduction stack with the rest of the buff when it's reciving damage?

45% more damage dealt , 45% less damage taken, and splash damage.  Maybe it's just me, but that seems a bit much.

It stacks up to 60% for damage at level 4, so yeah. Thats way too much. Why not just have it stack 4 times per level, OR increase its base by 2.5% per level? The first way gives it up to a 20% resistance increase while under fire at level 4, the second gives it an overall resistance of 20% at level 4. Works out the same both ways, two different ways to get to it and I think it's sorely needed.

Just played around with MicroPhaseJump and Maw combo, and god, its so much fun. Some people said the Maw is bugged somehow, but for me, it worked brilliantly everytime. The AI put 26k of bounty on my head and i decided to harass pirate fleet (quite a lot of ships) with the Titan at the Star, one phase jump away from the planet, they targeted. I MPJed toward them, activated Maw....and killed them all! Wow, just wow! 

Frankly, i do not think the Titan needs any buffs bar the Phase Stabiliser Spawn cooldown decrease. It may be fairly shit against other Titans/capitals, similarly to Kultorask, but it just pwns anything smaller. 

At the same time though, you have to consider that until it hits level six, it really has no effective combat ability.

on that 'in-grav' jump.  You already disable the phase jump of everything in a certain radius.  If the vasari scout capital had 'in-grav' jump with damage straight to hull, that might be balanced -just keep it channeling so it can't fire during duration.

What on earth are you talking about?  Subverters?  The Vorastra's MPJ definitely does not disable enemy ships.

Also, why do you want to buff the Antorak?  Sure, it's not the best capital ever, but this thread is more about the Vorastra.

@ Volt

As an endgame fleet support ship, the antorak kicks ass.  Its fleet speed enhancement alone is worth the entire cost of the capital ship.  If you get it to lvl 6, even better.  This ship improves the already incredibly mobile vasari fleet's kill speeds and allows the vasari fleet to actually catch up to a retreating force.  All you need is 1 of these bad boys.  If one of your capitals is getting heavily focused you can always phase it out to buy it time as well.  This ship performs its mission as a "black ops" vessel quite well, even if it isn't a good starting capital ship.  Its borderline OP when you have this ships movement bonus used in conjunction with a very strong vasari carrier group.  The Vasari endgame is given so many nasty, effective options because of this great ship.

I am not going to convince you otherwise, i would love it to see buffed, dont get me wrong. But perhaps its relative weakness is there to balance out the sheer power of  the Maw. Really, the other Titans have some great AoE abilities and kill fleet smaller ships easily - like Eradica with its Chastic Burst, Ragnarov with Scattershot, Kultorask with combination of its Nano-abilities....but none of them can do that instantly like the Maw. And i do not want to see it nerfed (drastically), nor other race-specific techs of Vasari Loyalists in a race to balance out now improved battle capabilities of the Titan.

TLDR: I fear the Vas Loyalists would be mightily nerfed elsewhere, if combat abilities of Vorastra were improved - in order to balance it out. I would prefer status quo. 

Something I noticed with MPJ is that it does not need to face the direction that it's jumping. It can be facing backwards already, and it can MPJ somewhere while still facing that direction, thus allowing it to use The Maw directly afterwards.

I do find it silly that it has two abilities that don't really help it in combat except in combination with The Maw. I think it would be nice if it were get a small buff afterwards that lasts say 10 seconds after using MPJ. The phase gate is perfectly fine as is.

oh, unintended post, quote instead of edit

I consider the vasari loyalist titan to be their equivalent to Air Force One, its supposed to be awesome but not intended for a direct combat role, and needs to be defended. In fact it should have command buffs that help direct other vasari vessels. 

A level three captial ship can easily destroy a level one VL titan one on one... but thats OK IMO

i noticed this as well, very cool feature could be used to pull off some very deadly combos

also i haven't seen anyone mention the bug where the maw does not give any experience from the ships it killed, this also hasn't been helping with its lvl gaining issues

i thought that was intended. Do other ultimate abilities give XP to other Titans? (Dissever for example) 

just tested dissever out, it does gain exp from its kills.

Umm..  AFO is armed (probably very heavily) and can perform maneuvers normally only done by ships a fraction of it's size.  It really is a floating fortress that would be capable of dispatching a signficant number of enemy craft before it's own survive comes into question.  It's defended "just-in-case."  Do you need two heavily modded 747's, and two F-22's for most missions?  No.  Could you wipe the floor with anything that gets in your way with such escorts?  Oh yeah.  

The Vasari would likely have a similar stance.  They'd build the most powerful titan, and if I had my way, this thing's damage output would dwarf that of the Ragnarov.  Yeah, it'd necessitate lots of other VL nerfs, but still.  The Vorastra is their last hope for survival basically.  They are going to make it ready to take on anything.

That said, while I would have been fine with it having fleet support roles, it at this point, IMO needs more minor changes than overhauls that you're suggesting would entail.

I think all of its abilities don't require any major buffs, its just the DPS that needs a large increase to make it effective. Maybe add some hull/armor as well.

I would hazard a guess that The Maw doesn't actually "kill" but is more a super instant salvage mechanic and thus doesn't trigger the experience process.  Not a bad balancing aspect for such an insanely powerful ability IMO - it is capable of instagibbing huge numbers of enemies and turning them into resources in your bank afterall.

I agree with the need for a bit more hardening and firepower since it has to get level 6 to use it's most powerful ability which then doesn't help it level any further - or even hinders it depending on how you look at it.

I would:

-Have the phase gun work like phase missiles and benefit from that research line.

-Have the wave attacks benefit from the wave research (that must be a bug).

-Since the dmg reduction from desperation doesn't stack up in battle like the weap cooldown the values are awefully low for what is supposed to be such a beast, maybe 3% per level?  Possibly more but really needs to go up somehow.

Its very possible. And yeah, once you gain the Maw, under current circumstances, its actually a thing of choice: either you want to level the Titan further or instagib enemy fleet... so perhaps its fair

I still fear, that devs are going to jump the gun and in order to satisfy the people, who want Vorastra to be buffed, will improve its DPS, but in turn nerf the Maw to oblivion to balance things out. It would be so much easier to discuss, if someone from the devteam - like Yarlen - actually stated what are they trying to do, and if the current state of things regarding Vorastra is actual intended and calculated approach, or its just a crude balance, which is bound to be subject of many further refinements. 

Why would the Maw have to be nerfed? It's currently working as intended all that i see changing is the resources that would be harvested from destroying ships.

The VL titan has really bad DPS problems, the wave cannon problem seems more like a bug than bad balance, the phase cannon on the other hand seems like just bad design/balance. Having the wave cannons scale with research and a small buff to it's phase cannon would largely improve the titan.

Theres a glitch with the in system phase jump

the in system jump does not let you jump out of a weapons way for example if you are micro pausing a battle (hitting pause every second) and a tec rebel titan fires its snipe at my titan and i have it paused just as the shot is leaving the tec rebel titan i jump but somehow my titan still gets damaged

there also seems to be some pathing issues when you command the titan to attack a planet that has mines / structrues the titan has to go around them and just just adjust its height

also the maw does not give you xp from destroyed ships

The VLT needs 

to have much much higher health (of ate least receive a massive bonus after you make it your home world)

it should also be able to jump anywhere to any system on the map at any time - give it the special abiliity of the cannon so it can open a jump point at the target system and then deploy a phase node

the maw should be able to target and completely strip a planet 

it needs some aft weapons - Really of the vasari are running you think they might have a few aft cannons encase this threat ever catches up

If you make the titan your homeworld and strip everything in sight your titan needs to reflect is importance - meaning a massive health increase & the ability have a massive amount of figheters/bombers just like a fullt defended desert or terran world

should also be able to build or deply phase jump inhibitors 

a level 1 VLT really should be able to handle itself quite well solo

I really liked the idea someone posted above about the in system jump having a area of effect damage 

Vasari loyalist cap ships and titan need to generate culture - allot of it - like an advent starbase can