Mage Spell Traits (Old vs New)

from Elemental Forums

legendary Heroes has changed and added a lot of new mage traits. Some, like savant and compassion are fun and interesting but many others are place holders or unnecessary. In fact it seems the new schools are crowding out the old elements.

Overall, skill trees are too long with repetitions of three skills with a "reward" skill for getting three blah ones. I play on a medium map and have conquered the entire world with no champions over lv12. At lv12 im not anywhere near the end of the summoning tree and its the more streamlined one. There are too many filler traits and weird new "magic school" books. We already had system for unlocking spells through trough traits and I liked it better.

Combo spells and elements special to each hero were a much better system than unlocking schools as we level. In LH we get nowhere near enough traits to unlock basic magic spells and these schools + whatever our specialty is. These traits need to be combined.

Additional schools like summoning and abjuration shouldn't add spells regardless of our basic magic elements. Ive always considered elemental affinity a large part of a Sovereigns identity. A none water mage shouldn't be getting hydromancy, it feels tacked on and unnecessary. Instead a better system would be a reward school that adds a spell for every element you have. So there would be destruction, summoning, strategic, curses, blesses, healing schools that contain a spell of every element, unlocked only if you have the prerequisite element.

Instead of leveling up to unlock wisps or ice elementals, you would learn "Conjuration I-III" which would unlock a summon for every element type you have.

Also there should be traits that make blesses more effective. Perhaps a trait requiring compassion that heals your target every time you buff a unit in tactical combat? Or a trait that makes you cast as if you had an additional shard of each type.

19,960 views 14 replies
Reply #1 from Elemental Forums Top

I think having generic Mage traits that vary what they give based on what actual elements you have access to is a great idea, helps differentiate multiple Mages from each other.

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

I agree about the repeat traits.  How much do they expect us to level up these guys?  I've never had a level 30 champion.  The trait trees are setup like that would be a normal thing. 

Galactic Civilizations IV
Reply #3 from Stardock Forums Top

Agree with the OP.

I think having generic Mage traits that vary what they give based on what actual elements you have access to is a great idea, helps differentiate multiple Mages from each other.

End of quote

Yep this.

 

What we have now is a weird mish mash.  You select "water mage" when creating a sov... then you after a few level ups you can choose "Pyromancy"... what the?   (Away from my game PC, that's probably not quite a correct example but you get the idea).

I agree it would be much better to be able to choose "Enchantments I", "Summoning I, II", etc which then unclocks additional spells in your element(s).

That'd be much neater.

 

Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

Agreed. The mix of air, water, fire and earth spells coming along despite your mage's basic spellbook choice is weird.

Reply #5 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting abob101, reply 3
I agree it would be much better to be able to choose "Enchantments I", "Summoning I, II", etc which then unclocks additional spells in your element(s).

That'd be much neater.
End of abob101's quote

The nice thing about Spell Defs is that they have AND prereqs, so this type of thing can easily be done.

Reply #6 from Elemental Forums Top

I mostly like this idea, but I can see two problems:

1. If what spells are available are more or less completely defined by what elements you have, you're at the mercy of which random champions turn up... (seriously; I've now got 5 in my most recent game and still got no earth or water)

2. ...and it gives Decalon factions like Pariden a significant advantage if they can take this `Enchantment 3` trait and BOOM! five new spells.

 

Maybe if it were easier for others to gain more spell trees, and you gave these traits the prerequisite of their relevant element trait...

 

Reply #7 from Elemental Forums Top

What if....

The base elemental magic trees had roughly half of the spells, both tactical and strategic that they do now.

The Mage path trees had a summoner path, a tactical path, and a strategic path that gave static bonuses and unlocked additional abilities from the elemental paths you had masterd.

So to get summon fire elemental you would need 4 ranks in both the Fire Elemental path and the Mage Summoning line.  Additional lower level Fire summons could be added as well.

Reply #8 from Elemental Forums Top

Some suggestions:

Pyro/Aero/Aqua/Geo mancy should require a point in the appropiate spell school, and branch off the same perk.  

Those skills should give a weak spell, and +1 Shard Power per 5 levels on the appropiate shard

 

Then your summons and other spells should branch off that.

 

That said, at level 5 you should be able to get apprentice in the other spell schools.

 

Steal spirit should give +1 if the stolen spirit has the appropiate elemental school.  Example: you steal spirit someone with Fire Disciple.

If you have Fire Apprentice you can get Disciple

If you have nothing, you can get Apprentice

If you have Disciple, you won't get Mage.

 

Reply #9 from Elemental Forums Top

I would like to see the trait selection be more vertical than horizontal, with more starting points.

Reply #10 from Elemental Forums Top

Ya we already have elemental magic traits the new ones like pyromancy aren't necessary. Maybe they could give +1 shard power instead, or just be replaced with destruction, enchantment, and conjuration as other have said.

Also I really like the idea of broader summoning traits that unlock multiple elementals that still require elmental proficiency. This would be a much better system.

Reply #11 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting Alstein, reply 8
Pyro/Aero/Aqua/Geo mancy should require a point in the appropiate spell school, and branch off the same perk.

Those skills should give a weak spell, and +1 Shard Power per 5 levels on the appropiate shard
End of Alstein's quote

That could work too. It would be great to have some way to artificially boost shards.

 

I would like to see the trait selection be more vertical than horizontal, with more starting points.
End of quote

I'd like to see some love for buffs like I said in the OP. A small 4-5 trait tree for healing and buffs would be great.

 

                                                              ----- Mass Blessing: Single target tactical buffs become AOE

Compassion   ------   Invigoration       ----   

+50% healing      + 5+1 Heal on buff       ----- Lightbringer: +20% healing, unlocks AOE healing spell that damages enemies

 

Traits like these would not only add variety but breathe some life into underused tactical spells. Traits shouldn't be affecting just background statistics but changing the way a character plays.

Reply #12 from Elemental Forums Top

Magi specialization shoud improve existing spells, not adding new ones directly.

If champion have fire\death 2\2 soulburn shoud be automatically allowed, without wasting trait point on piromancy. 

 

Only possible specialization inside magi is life school for empire and death for kingdom, this will provide greater flexability. 

everything else shoud improve\alter existing spells, all trait spells shoud be returned to magic pool. 

Reply #13 from Elemental Forums Top

The Warrior Path is getting a overhaul in 0.52. Hopefully so does the Mage Path.

Reply #14 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting sharpxe, reply 12
Magi specialization should improve existing spells, not adding new ones directly.

If champion have fire\death 2\2 soulburn should be automatically allowed, without wasting trait point on pyromancy.
End of sharpxe's quote

I did really like the dual element spells, certainly a lot better than Spellbooks turning water mages into pyromancers. Adding a bunch of fire spells that any lv 18 mage can get cheapens both starting elements and overextends the trait tree.

That said I would like to see a few cool traits that add spells based on your elements. This is fine because it wouldn't be a prerequisite like the random elementals in the mage tree. Imagine a early game shrill summoning trait that allows you to summon shrills of any element you have.

Quoting DsRaider, reply 13
The Warrior Path is getting a overhaul in 0.52. Hopefully so does the Mage Path.
End of DsRaider's quote

Fingers Crossed