This same discussion occured with the Galciv games. They eventually came out with expansions to fill that. The Galcivs and Sins dont necessarily need a campaign but I think everyone would agree that they certainly wouldnt mind if it had one.

I think it may be a mistake to consider any space-based strategy game a 4X game. For me at least, one of the defining features of the 4X template is the ability to both write your own story and control all aspects of your empire. If a campaign were to be implemented, it would be hard to do so without restricting both of those things. By giving preset goals and a gradually unfolding tech tree, the player loses significant control. Not only that, but for me one of the most interesting aspects of a 4X game is to balance conflicting goals and requirements. A campaign answers those questions for you. The goals of the game designers are always paramount. Of course, how you achieve those goals is still an open question. However, coupling that slow introduction of gameplay elements narrows the focus of the game. I think this would work against the games strengths. That being said, I think introducing alternate victory paths (in previous 4X games such as Civ I-IV, MOO I-III, MOM, Gal Civ I-II, Alpha Centauri etc. these paths have traditionally been tech, diplomacy, and economic victory) would create more choices. It would be interesting, but would, in my opinion, require a large overhall of the game. Those three aspects of the game have been simplified at least in part because the game does take place in real time and a balance had to be struck. As such, I don't think they aren't well developed enough to really form the center of your game.
It's a shame because I think that storytelling is one of the most compelling elements of gaming. I play single player almost exclusively and most of my favorite games, with the exception of 4X games, are all story driven. I just feel that in this case a campaign undercuts the games strengths. If they can find a way to include more story elements without restricting player control, I say bring it on.

The difference here is, there's an obviously massive backstory to this game which is completely and totally unexplored. There's this mysterious destructive force that wiped the Vasari Empire from existence and is on its way to TEC space, but you never see or hear anything about them in the game. It would be like playing Master of Orion 2: Battle at Antares, and not ever discovering or even hearing about the Master of Orion or the Antarans...wtf would even be the point then? Yes this game is great fun on its own, but there's a big story just sitting there waiting to be told.

to be fair i'm expecting the the mysterious race to turn up as part of some kind of expation at some point.

/Signed

But not an expansion pack, make it a patch

They've already said tons of times they're planning a campaign for the expansion It would only be logical to assume the 4th race will be involved

Most of people won't know this, but not too long before game launch, Blair basically told the beta testers that a lot of things were "in motion" as it were.. they already have ideas and plans, and most importantly: THEY want to finish telling the story, which is pretty much all the encouragement the player base should need - because it means we don't need to ask for it, we'll just get it.



This can't happen, too many game changes to make it a patch. A good campaign would be a major project, a lot bigger than a patch.

I also think a campaign would be nice. The campaign is normally a good way for people to learn the game, by introducing new units gradually and extending more features to the player over time. It was really valuable to me in a game like C&C3, and it's more fun than the trial and error of figuring things out in a skirmish.

Plus, it would be neat to experience the stories of the factions a bit, as of now it's just kind of sitting in the manual and seems like an afterthought.

To me, the developers seemed to have made some strange choices in what to include/focus on in the game. It has an interesting AI/diplomacy system, and a neat story, but no campaign to take advantage of them. It has a fresh take on rts and an innovative passive aggressive bounty system for multiplayer, but the multiplayer community is crippled by the peer to peer framework. I like the game, but these things feel like they're missing.

There are probably enough people who want a campaign mode for SINS that the devs will eventually do something about it. Although i doubt it will be anything comparable to the campaign modes of previous games.

I don't like campaign modes myself. The "stories" may seem interesting to kids but for adults, they're more likely to be seen as silly sci-fi schlock. If i want a great story line, I'll watch Battlestar Galacttica on tv. Or, better yet, read an actual book.

I'm not looking for a great story in a strategy game. I'll looking for a great strategy game in a strategy game. I want to be able to replay the game using different strategies. The more strategies one can employ to win, the greater the replay value.

For this reason, i don't think SINS needs a linear storyline, but rather, more strategic material added to the game in the form of new techs, ships, better diplomacy, espionage, races, more varied interstellar objects, etc. The additions of these sorts of things should add more strategic variety and depth to the game. And that's what i hope they do.

Hrm

Yeah I think there should be a campaign, and since the maps we have now are limited to a couple stars with lots of planets, I think the campaign should be with levels like a traditional RTS, so it could span bunches of stars, I think the game would need to be faster paced, in a campaign like, that so it wouldn't take years to complete, and I'm not sure you could keep your technologies between map or redevelop them or keep old units. I'm just thinking of problems and solutions with a campaign in Sins.

LOL gotta love the progression of the dialog in these kinds of threads.

"They gotta make a campaign!! It's just begging to be made!!!!"

"K well they already said they're putting one in the expansion"

"IF ENOUGH PEOPLE DEMAND A CAMPAIGN THE DEVS WILL EVENTUALLY LISTEN!!!!"

"But they're making one already. They WANT to finish the story."

"I would like to see a campaign too, but I don't really ever expect one to be made"

"PLEASE listen to the community, make a campaign!!"

"...."



^^

The "...." is where your post comes in to bring it to a rather funny closure

They do. Or at least the Trade Order did. Unfortunately, for the player, most of the former Trade Order planets didn't join the Emergency Coalition because they feared loss of planetary autonomy, like countries not willing to cooperate.

They've nevertheless all built planetary fleets to defend their individual planets(the 'neutrals'), so those things must be swept aside in order for diplomats and colonists on board the Protevs/Akkans to enlist the planets into the Coalition(or get oppressed and enslaved by the Vasari, or assimilated into the Unity by the Advent).

Considering that most gamers are <40 i see no problem with "story-based" RTS for "kids".
I doubt that games like Starcraft or Warcraft would have been such a hit without the thrilling story. A good story should be like reading a good book. With an proper Campaign you can identify yourself with the partys.


And if i want to play optical pimped chess, i buy chess(may be out of polished titan:-)). A proper game has to be an at least a good strategygame AND have a good story. Its like an crossword and scrabble. In both cases you do basicly the same but the framework(the friends) make scrabble more fun.

I totally want a campaign too. Those who doesn't want one doesn't have to play it, simple as that.

I got bored with the game quite fast to be honest. I played it a few times and uninstalled it. After a few patches it might be worth installing again so hopefully it will be money well spent in the end.

Until then ...

Luckily at the current Euro/dollar-rate it wasn't that expensive

I agree there should be a campaign mode. Maybe in the near future.

Not a big fan of the campaign. I love the endless replayability of games like sins, civ etc with random world generators. If they do add a campaign please put it on the bottom of the list.

So, after half a year of game existence, there is still no campaign...

They said the expansion would contain the campaign. Your statement would be more to the point as "So, after half a year of game existence, the expansion isn't out yet..." which is, I hope you'll admit, a rather insipid way of looking at it. If you calm down and wait, it'll come

Hmm... I missed that. I thought people were saying that they release it with a patch (they even were saying a particular patch number). But I guess now we have to pay for the campaing... I doupt that expancion will be free, and I do not really enjoy just playing vs. battles in this game.

when are you monkeys going to figure out THIS IS NOT A 4X GAME. maybe it's the most complicated game YOU have ever played, so you're proud of yourselves, but it is NOT 4x.

Yeah, a story makes any game much more interesting, and this game has a very good setup for an intriguing story-line...

I totally agree.

yup, campaign is needed. it gives players something to do after being spammed by "X" and holds their interest -if the campaign is worth it's salt.

Give the community a campaign editor and let us tell the damn story.