Possible solution to phase stabilizer imbalance

from Sins Forums
Part of the problem with Phase Stabilizers and Dark Armada is that they give you top-tier units right away. That means that I am getting FREE cruisers and enforcers while my opponents are still a few levels below me on the tech tree. What if the Armada ability only gave you ships that you had researched? I am not 100% certain that this would work, but it might stop crazy exploits like I have been pulling off (hey, I like the Vasari :p).
17,346 views 8 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top
Or what if occasionally, instead of getting ships through the Dark Armada, you accidentally got what's been chasing the Vasari all this time...
Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top
Returning Armada is powerful, but I don't think it's actually more powerful than other end-game abilities. I've certainly beaten people who've returning-armada rushed.

Maybe Heavy Cruisers could use a weight increase, though.
Ashes of the Singularity II
Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top
What if the Armada ability only gave you ships that you had researched?
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Sweet, want to spam bombers? Only research carrier. Want to spam crusiers? Only research those...
Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top
That doesn't quite work, because you'll still get skirmishers mixed in. I maintain that a mixed fleet is stronger than a mass of the same unit. Still, I see your point.
Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top
Returning Armada is powerful, but I don't think it's actually more powerful than other end-game abilities. I've certainly beaten people who've returning-armada rushed.Maybe Heavy Cruisers could use a weight increase, though.
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It might not be that much more powerful than other endgame abilities, but it is better than everything up until endgame. You could get a multitude of stabilizers and the tech near the beginning of the game when everyone else can't even research ships that stand a chance. While everyone else has to extensively research and build economy in order to build a substantial fleet, the Vasari only need an extremely small economy and one line of research to build and sustain a more than substantial fleet. It is literally impossible to counter unless you can kill the person going for it before they attain it. After it gets started, the only way to counter it is if you team up against the person with it and it would still be hard to win.

Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top
It might not be that much more powerful than other endgame abilities, but it is better than everything up until endgame. You could get a multitude of stabilizers and the tech near the beginning of the game when everyone else can't even research ships that stand a chance. While everyone else has to extensively research and build economy in order to build a substantial fleet, the Vasari only need an extremely small economy and one line of research to build and sustain a more than substantial fleet. It is literally impossible to counter unless you can kill the person going for it before they attain it. After it gets started, the only way to counter it is if you team up against the person with it and it would still be hard to win.
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Erm, I have to disagree. Returning Armada is a long way from being an 'I win' button.

The costs to get to Returning Armada and build enough phase stabilisers to make it useful are pretty steep, and to do it quickly requires a powerful economy, which puts you in a position where you need to save every credit and resource for research and building stabilisers, but also need to expand rapidly.

I'm not saying it isn't powerful, but I don't think it's over-powered, and nor do I think that rushing to it is the only viable strategy for the Vasari.
Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top
I hate the ability and believe it to be failsauce. When playing Vasari, which is pretty much every time, I never research the Pirate Xenophobia or the Returning Armada techs. Random, bad combo ships are not good...
Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top
You get a pretty good mix of ships, actually. I've found I usually get an average of 1-2 enforcers, 2-3 assailants, 0-1 flak, and 1-2 carriers per fleet. That seems like a good composition for a balanced force.

As for defeating the rush-to-tech strategy, it's not hard 1v1. 1v1, Returning Armada is not really viable as a fast tech. You could fast expand and tech to trade (which requires 4 bloody labs...), turtle, and THEN tech to Returning Armada (and I've done it, and that works) but that takes longer than the 35-45 fast-tech does and I'd consider it a fair game. FFA/Teams is where Returning Armada shines, because you are much less likely to have to beat off early attacks. Countering it there IS hard.