'Hold Position' bugs as TEC Enclave.

from Sins2 Forums

I've been playing as the TEC Enclave and experiencing issues ordering my ships to hold position, no idea if this problems exists for other factions/ships, as this is all I have played thus far.

The first problem is with Sova Carriers.  Ordering them to hold position cause their strike craft to idle and do absolutely nothing in battles, they don't automatically engage anything unless the ships are set to engage anywhere... But having a Sova Carrier set to engage anywhere causes it to fly into nigh suicidal fights by itself since I have my Sova Carriers leading fleets of Percheron Carriers for all carrier fleets meant to hold position far away from battles.  The same holds true for the Percheron Carriers as well, but having them set to engage anywhere is less of an issue since they don't actually attack anything themselves and sit still regardless of what stance they are in.

The second problem is with Marza Dreadnoughts.  For a similar reason to above (not wanting ships to fly into suicidal fights when I am not looking or some such), I have all of my ships set to hold position so I can micro manage them in fights... But the Marza Dreadnoughts ignore that hold position stance and continue to fly off by themselves and engage things.

Thanks

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2,943 views 10 replies
Reply #1 from Sins2 Forums Top

Seeing the same with the missle dreadnaught.  Really annoying trying to prevent them from killing themselves.

The Political Machine 2024
Reply #3 from Sins2 Forums Top

The reason is simple it seems, carriers don't engage enemies which are not in range of the carriers' weapons (if any). Sure it doesn't make any sense and must be fixed.

Dreadnoughts probably trying to reach the range of all installed weapons, not only LRM.

So the whole "hold position" command behavior is weird and must be fixed. It doesn't actually "hold position", but "hold until no enemy in range of any installed weapon, then engage and feel free to move".

For most carriers it's just a disaster now (except ones which don't have any weapons installed), for other ships should be fixed to actually forcing the ship to hold this exact position.

Reply #4 from Sins2 Forums Top

Thirding this! I tried holding position with the Halcyon Carrier at the edge of a gravity well and the strike craft abandoned the enemies and returned to its side. The only way I could get around this was to set a bunch of waypoints for the Carrier while the strike craft went around the gravity well and attacked. But that is far too much micro during intense battles.

Reply #5 from Sins2 Forums Top

Fouthing. It's especially noticeable on the Vasari carrier cruisers, since they're equipped with some point defense weapons (presumably to offset the fact that Vasari don't have fighters). It's extremely annoying that my fleet of squishy carrier cruisers keep trying to drive to the other side of the gravity well to plink away at the enemy fleet with their little PD guns.

Reply #6 from Sins2 Forums Top

Not so much a solution but I was poking around the entity files a bit. You'll find in the Entities folder things listed as .unit files, those contain the behaviors for all the craft and structures/AI targeting behaviors/weapon firing angles. Haven't had time to work at it personally but if anyone wants to give it some poking and prodding to see what they can figure out it's there.

 

For instance the file advent_carrier_capital_ship.unit is for our the Halcyon carrier.

"move":

    {

        "follow_distance": 2799.928711

    },

    "attack":

    {

        "attack_pattern":

        {

            "type": "stop_and_fire",

            "rotate_only_on_plane": true

        }

    },

    "ai":

    {

        "attack_target_type_groups": [

            "heavy_capital",

            "defense"

        ],

        "attack_target_type_groups_to_ignore": [

            "torpedo_strikecraft"

        ],

        "attack_target_type_groups_matching_weapon": "advent_carrier_capital_ship_beam",

        "auto_follow_target_priority": 5.0,

        "pursuit":

        {

            "min_distance_to_target": 5000.0

        }

    },

    "ai_attack_target":

    {

        "attack_priority": 50.0,

        "is_always_a_threat": true,

        "attack_target_type": "capital"

 

If we can define out what each of these properties correspond with on the Fighter/bomber units then we can adjust whichever accordingly to get the desired "carrier behavior" instead of every capital ship trying to be a line ship.

Hope this helps, been away for a while lol

Reply #7 from Sins2 Forums Top

I'm having the same but with Marza and the Ragnarov. The titan shrugs most off, but the Marza is like an annoying child in a Shopping Mall... hope SD fixes this soon as it's annoying (ok, mildly, but still)

Reply #8 from Sins2 Forums Top

Quoting BadTune, reply 6

If we can define out what each of these properties correspond with on the Fighter/bomber units then we can adjust whichever accordingly to get the desired "carrier behavior" instead of every capital ship trying to be a line ship.
End of BadTune's quote

Thanks for sharing.

"min_distance_to_target" edit does nothing unfortunately.

I see no other opportunities in this file, fighters are not even in "weapons" group.

But I have zero experience modding SoSE, maybe I missing something.

Reply #9 from Sins2 Forums Top

Ok it seems after some digging I have solved this puzzle. Definitely not the best way, but it will do.

In e.g. advent_carrier_capital_ship.unit we can replace the "ai" section content, from

    "ai":
    {
        "attack_target_type_groups": [
            "heavy_capital",
            "defense"
        ],
        "attack_target_type_groups_to_ignore": [
            "torpedo_strikecraft"
        ],
        "attack_target_type_groups_matching_weapon": "advent_carrier_capital_ship_beam",
        "auto_follow_target_priority": 5.0,
        "pursuit":
        {
            "min_distance_to_target": 5000.0
        }
    },


to

    "ai":
    {
        "behaviors": [
            "auto_attack_threats_no_move"
        ],
        "attack_target_type_groups_to_ignore": [
            "torpedo_strikecraft"]
    },

The difference looks like that, the left is a new one:

I found this "auto_attack_threats_no_move" behavior in sins2.exe, no idea if any ship or structure currently uses it, but it works as described, carrier is using abilities, shooting all guns, automatically pointing to the target it is currently attacking with main weapons, and not going anywhere, even if I order to attack something out of range of all weapons and abilities. But fighters sure go. Simple move orders also work.

Another option is "auto_follow_unit_attacking_threat" behavior that Vasari Overseer uses. The difference seems is, with this behavior carrier will move if I directly command to attack something out of range, but otherwise hold position. But also will not automatically rotate to focus weapons on any target in range, only after direct attack command. So if main guns can't fire because of the angle, the ship will ignore that by default.

Not sure if any other behavior differences vs default game.

All carrier ships files in \Steam\steamapps\common\Sins2\entities\:

advent_carrier_capital_ship.unit
advent_carrier_cruiser.unit
trader_carrier_capital_ship.unit
trader_carrier_cruiser.unit
vasari_carrier_capital_ship.unit
vasari_carrier_cruiser.unit

No idea if works in multiplayer.

Feel free to use, create mods etc.

Reply #10 from Sins2 Forums Top

解决方法如下：

1、在对应航母文件“.unit” 里面，删除炮击ai语句

2、航母选择保持位置

3、屏幕右上角，星系总单位列表中，选中战斗机，选择“随时投入战斗”