Making flags uncappable

He can't capture the flag with an enemy demigod blocking him, keep a tele scroll handy and head back when he tries it.

Shield only lasts 6 seconds and he's in the middle of your base, you should have a good chance of to killing him.

Yep, doing this would be a good way. Or if you see a player who is known to do that kind of things: Keep an extra eye on your portal flags, buy yourself a Capture Lock and if you see that he's going to your base port there with a scroll and lock your flag before he can do it. Normally he have to run trough half of you base, so you should be able to see his attempt more than fast enough.

And if you've lost vision in your base you can buy totems of revelation (really cheap) and use them to make up for that.

Noob sauce just got pwnt by the community.

just lock the flag yourself before or stand nearby til the shield wears off.

IMO the flags should have a chain of control.

But yea, always have a TP (never played dota? =o)

I played dota, and when i went to the enemy base to kill stuff i was called "omg backdoor, banned". I'm not complaining about the fact that he can walk into our base and cap flags even though he is invulnerable, i just dont like the fact that i cant take them back even though he is in his base buying stuff or away taking another flag (and making it uncappable). It's a ridiculous tactic.

HEY COOL.  YOU DISCOVERED A VIABLE STRATEGY.

baww banlist for backdooring etc.

~_~

I love when someone didn't think of a strategy themselves, so it is obviously OP. Oh, and Usling, this isn't dota. Flag locks are SO CHEAP that you should always have them along with teleport scrolls. If you can't manage to play and pay attention to your map, then its your own damn fault. There is almost no way to waltz into someones base and backdoor cap without prior warning that it would happen, unless they have already knocked down your towers in that area, in which case you suck and they deserve to cap you portals. Come one people, if you suck at the game, admit it to yourselves and move on. Everything is not over powered because YOU lost to it, despite how uber you think you are. Mature a little bit, learn from mistakes, and improve. This game is still too young to be calling anything OP.

/End rant against stup people.

No offense, but a high powered rook can knock down a tower before enemy DG's can respond assuming zero reaction time, much less before they can kill him or with a human reaction time.  Other DG's have similar advantages.

Hehe, that's funny.

Short version: LEARN TO PLAY THE GAME

Lord Erebus can just swarm past them, TB can freeze the towers and then BAM a portal!!

It is a bit overpowered I think, because you really have to be aware. And even if you are aware of it you might be a demigod who is too weak to stop it, and your allies do not see it or is in a fight, too bad game over ...... A bit hars .

Uhh this is a completely fair strategy, and in fact the only map you can really do it on is cataract. First off... do you have any idea how much money/time it takes to produce giants? If you've let them get giants, chances are you've already lost. this strategy minimally needs  catapults before its even remotely viable.

Second, cap locks only last 30 seconds. That's enough time for exactly 1 full wave to get through the portal. If you don't respond to them taking your portal within that amount of time you're oblivious to what's going on in the game and once again deserve to lose.

Third, based on the amount of money they've had to spend in order to get giants, you can safely assume their gear sucks pretty hard. assuming you've spent money on yourself the whole game it shouldn't be that much of a challenge for you to kill them.

This strategy is hard enough to pull off against an incompitent player, against a compitent player it almost never works. You'd have to be up against like 2 level 20 rooks who completely barricade up the flags with towers.

As everyone else has said, you found a new strategy, learn to use it and learn to counter it. Don't whine about it being overpowered.

Guys oak keeps taking my flags with last stand nerf plox.

I don't think the concept is OP, but the execution may be slightly too powerful.  Frankly, it doesn't take very long to get through the towers, capture the flag, and lock it.  This isn't really that much of a problem.  The lock lasts just about long enough for a creep wave.  Again, this isn't really a problem.

The problem is that once the lock is worn off, you can lock it again.  This may not sound like a problem, but considering you can tele scroll to the falg (since it is under your control) and lock it againas soon as it comes unlocked, this becomes somewhat of an issue.  If you time it properly so you pop out of tele just as the flag is unlocked, there is very little the opposing team can do to prevent you from locking the flag again.

Just brainstorming on the spot, but I can think of two obvious options that could be used to stop this without removing portal locking as a strategic option.

1)  Make it impossible to teleport to a locked flag.  While you could still run in and lock the flag as soon as it became unlocked, it would be much more difficult than simply tele scrolling in.

2)  Give flags a Lock Immunity similar to Stun Immunity.  For perhaps... 10 seconds after a flag is locked, it cannot be locked again.  This forces the offending team to actually hold the flag for short periods of time to prevent it from falling back into enemy hands.  Right now, you can just pop in real fast and lock it again.  If there was a short period of Lock Immunity, it would be significantly more difficult to hold on to an enemy portal.

For the record, I have never lost to this strategy.  Don't come in here and ignore everything I said assuming I'm some whining n00b complaining over a game where the other team out-played me .

Then you've been playing against incompetent teams. Cap lock has a 30 second cooldown, telescroll has something similar. If you teleport out immediately as you caplock the flag (which you would need to do in order for your teleport scroll cooldown to be up again when the cap lock runs out) then the enemy player should easily be able to take back the area from the oncoming wave. Giving him control of this area allows one of 2 things.

1. Your teleport back is not timed absolutely perfectly, and even if it is, the amount of time you've allowed him to sit on the flag while you casted teleport allowed him to make the flag neuteral, blocking a caplock from you.

2. You make it back in time to place a second cap lock, as you fumble around with casting it and sit there while the cast timer goes off, you allow him free hits on you. Since you've just teleported your teleport cooldown is not up and so therefore now you have to fight him and he has a head start. Assuming he's not terrible, you're going to die. Putting a death penalty on you and not allowing you to get back in time to do another cap lock.

If you do this repeatedly, hopefully their team would be a little more aware and try to counter you every time you made an attempt to cap lock it by using teleport scrolls. If you do it repeatedly and they still allow you to continue doing it, they're not a good team, and they most likely would have lost regardless of what strat you used.

I don't know what the actual flag behavior is while they are locked and I can't convince the AI to help me test it (yes, I tried).  What I do recall is a specific match where a Reg decided to stand next to the locked flag the entire time and I was still able to port in and lock it again.

Also, the Flag Lock is 45 seconds and the Tele Scroll cooldown is around 30 seconds.  That is not an issue.

Firstly, using Erebus nullifies all your points as he can stun them with Mass Charm and run away with Bat Swarm.  Other Demigods, while not quite so aptly suited, still have things they can do.  Rook and Ice TB can stun the enemy while you lock, QoT has great survivability with Mulch and Bramble, Sedna is tough to kill with massive regen and Heal, and Oak can use Shield to either cap undisturbed or run away.  Additionally, minion build generals are only slightly inconvenienced if the actual Demigod is busy locking the flag.  (For example, Oak can pop in and quickly Surge and Penitance before starting the lock while his minion swarm does all the damage.)  Also, if the timing works out, there may be allied Giants/Catas in the exchange.

And this is all assuming there is only one Demigod dealing with this on each side.  You can throw some nasty Demi combinations together for an unstoppable flag re-lock.  For example, Erebus starts to teleport.  Oak Shields Erebus.  Erebus finishes teleporting.  Erebus stuns all nearby Demigods with Mass Charm (this cannot be stopped/interrupted due to Shield).  Erebus locks the flag.  Erebus runs/Bat Swarms away.  Even if the entire enemy team is sitting on the flag, they can't stop this from happening.

And here's the best part.  You don't even have to kill the defender.  Its a win for you if the enemy falls back or you can manage to run away after the flag is locked.  Just get in and out without getting yourself killed.

The cap lock only lasts for 30 seconds, of this I am positive, so either your cooldown times are incorrect, or you just nullified your argument. That being, you could not keep it chain locked because you have a 15 second downtime in between locks.

I don't know man, I play erebus alot, as well as rook. I'm no stranger to this strategy. I've had no problem defending against it because I know what to look for. Conversely I seldomly have any trouble pulling the strategy off. I can only think of one or two games where the enemy team was smart enough to block me from doing it.

That being said, its not an infallable strategy and it can be defended against making it not overpowered. After peopel use it enough, peopel will know what to look for and it will be seldom used because it's easily countered simply by watching your portal flags.

That may be, but at the same time you don't have to kill them either, you just have to stand on the flag. Its your base so as long as the portal is still in your posession, a fight against them is in your favor. All you have to do is chase them away, if they don't run they die. It's not rocket science.

O rly?

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/8373/clipboard01uhh.png

And either way, you could just have a second Demigod port in and lock it anyway.

Give me examples because I honestly can't think of any.  If the strat is executed properly, it would be extremely difficult to stop.  Maybe even impossible if the proper combination of Demigods is executing it.

Hmm pwned I suppose. I always thought it was 30 seconds.

Like I said, if you know what to look for, its easy to counter. Always keep a teleport scroll on hand. If you see them bipass your money/cooldown flag you know where they're going, just start your teleport then. You'll be able to beat them to capping the flag, and with luck have a wave of your own units assist you in chasing them off/killing them.

If they have 2 demigods... then you're going to need a team mate to help you.

Now you are discussing the initial cap/lock, which I don't have a problem with.  The problem comes up once you get a successful lock.  Getting the first lock can be difficult, but keeping it locked is too easy imo.  My suggested change is to introduce Lock Immunity.  Sneaking in and ninjaing a portal will be just as hard and will still cripple the enemy, at least for the next creep wave or two.  (I'm not really sure how frequently creeps spawn, but I imagine you could probably get two waves from this if you time it correctly.)  The problem comes in once that lock expires, as there is virtually no way for the defending team to retake their portal.  Lock Immunity would force the offenders to actually hold the portal, at least for a short while, between flag locks.

It would still be doable, it would just be a little more difficult.

I'd really like to have Universal Gadgets being able to remove a cap lock.

Erebus is actually better at this than oak.  Remember Oak's invulnerability lasts only 6 seconds at most and has about a 30 second cooldown.  He is hardly invincible for a long time.  So you should be able to protect your flags and drive him out of your base fairly easily in most situations.  Erebus can just batform past the towers in the places where this works.