Space Combat--Strategic/tactical Choices beforehand

Just like ground combats

from GalCiv2 Forums
I know this would be a bit of work, and we probably won't see it for a good many patches (if ever), but I thing being able to make some combat choices just before a space battle would be a nice feature. You can already do this sort of thing with ground combat, so I don't think it fits the game philosophically (unlike MOO2-esque tactical combat).

This could be used to help differentiate weapon-types as well. If mass drivers are supposed to be close-ranged weapons, then using them most effectively might require some close-ranged tactic to be selected. Your missile boats and such, on the other, might hang back and fire from a distance. Or perhaps an option to let a large ship with a ton of hitpoints rush into the enemy to take the brunt of the damage would be available, hence helping to keep your smaller ships from being blown up in an instant. This could help spread out damage in a battle too, so all your ships could potentially be a bit damaged instead of everyship (save perhaps one) either at full health or destroyed.

Of course, both sides would need to pick a tactic, and different combinations would have different results (and perhaps some might result in survivors on both sides). Compared to tactical combat this doesn't involve complicated ship management AI, but rather just the ability to select from a discrete list once for each battle. For the player this similarly doesn't require him to be any good at executing any given tactic, just good at picking an overall tactic/strategy for the battle. I think this avoids the pitfalls of tactical combat for both the AI and players.

I realize, of course, that this isn't a trivial task however. Certainly different choices ought to make the combat view play out differently for one, and deciding on what strategies should be available and how they calculate battle outcomes is another issue as well. On the whole though, I think it would add a lot to the game, such as picking a strategy that helps minimize the weakness of your current ship designs compared to the enemy while you start preparing ships that are geared towards tackling them.

Thoughts?
12,786 views 10 replies
Reply #1 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Hey I totally agree with you, but it seems at this stage I very much doubt that it will be included in the game ever.

Another possibilities are to put various type of shield, weapons that are not only one type but a mix of both and may be a hull type that more resistant to certain type of damage but weak against other. They seems a bit more plausible.
Reply #2 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Actually, it would probably best if they just use the current model, but copy the battle options from "Reach for the Stars!". Basically in that game when two fleets meet up, during each round of combat, you get to select your tactic: Short, Medium, Long Range, or Retreat. Then, whoever has the faster engines get to use their tactics. So if you chose short range, and he chose long range, but you are faster, the combat will happen at short range. This goes rather well with what you suggest about which weapon works best at what range. This adds a second dimention to the rock, paper, scissor game that may very well be worth pursuing.

Also, when you chose retreat, if you are faster, you are able to retreat first, as opposed to getting shot before being able to retreat. The only problem I see with this method in GalCiv is that when you retreat, you can just attack again if you have movement, which may be a bad thing, as it probably means many retreating battles. At the same time, however, it might be a good tactic to draw out a battle, mimicking a fast scout that keeps running away from combat, or the intentional luring away of combat ships so you can sneak attack with another.

There are definitely many simple, subtle adjustments that can make the combat more interesting, this range option, the ability to cloak so you can hit first, etc. However, as much as I would like for them to be in the game, it might not be wise to implement them at the moment because of various issues with how the AI will have to handle those tactics. Perhaps sometime down the line, or in the expansion pack, after the team has gotten some sleep.
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Reply #3 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Me's want combat tactical, me's want to order suicide run into enemy battleship. ME's want to tell fighter to flank evil Torian slug and stab in back.

But alas no such luck

Tactical combat would make GC2 a whole 1 star better in my opinion, and it is already good. I can't want to get my hands on Space Empires 5 tactical combat, NOW thats going to be interesting, you can apparently do anything in its combat system, launch missiles, fighters, drop mines, drones, ram ships, have suicide ships, use worm hole weapons, shield damaging only weapons, etc... the options are pretty much limitless.
Reply #4 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
REACH FOR THE STARS was utter SH*T how dear you mention it in context to a superior product like GalCiv2.

Begone wrong doer!
Reply #5 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Me's want combat tactical, me's want to order suicide run into enemy battleship.

Good lord, I know you speak English because you did it in the last paragraph of your post, even going so far as to use commas, which is beyond the grasp or concern of many people online. What is this childish pronoun use? "Me's want" isn't making your position any more appealing.

Regarding the original post, I'd rather not see this feature implemented. Not only would it a take a lot of work that could be spent on other more pressing matters, but it would likely detract from the gameplay that many people currently enjoy. If one tactic is ideal for your current ship design, the task of selecting that option is just busy work.
Reply #6 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
It would be nice if they would retreat when losing a battle. Who wants suicidal Admirals. Look at the battleship era, they were too expensive to lose.
Reply #7 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Good lord, I know you speak English because you did it in the last paragraph of your post, even going so far as to use commas, which is beyond the grasp or concern of many people online. What is this childish pronoun use? "Me's want" isn't making your position any more appealing.


Gooooooood lord get a clue, its a act, as in pretending to be a spoiled bratt wanting more more more. Me's want!

Its a joke.

J
Reply #8 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Hail Admirals

Mission: Do a suicidal run into the enemy lines, now I know all you have at your disposal is 3 light fighters and a garbage tug but hey nevermind, good luck against those 8 battleships.


Yes a think a retreat option could be useful. LOL

J
Reply #9 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Some Years ago, the was a game out called ST:BotF, I ever thought this one nedded to be polished up. And it did,--sort of-- with GC1. It already had a combat system quite similar to the CVscreen in GC2. However, you were able to focus attack on capital ships,etc...simply it was turn based. In my opinion, an expanded "clone" of that system would do. It doesn't have to be complex, beeing able to control every single shot. It it was that I'd rather prefer some "Fleetmanager" assistance
Reply #10 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
There are definitely many simple, subtle adjustments that can make the combat more interesting, this range option, the ability to cloak so you can hit first, etc. However, as much as I would like for them to be in the game, it might not be wise to implement them at the moment because of various issues with how the AI will have to handle those tactics. Perhaps sometime down the line, or in the expansion pack, after the team has gotten some sleep.


True, that is the primary issue, but that's also one reason way something with limited options is so much better than the relatively infinitely complex system of full tactical combat. With a set number of options and set ways of calculating battles, the AI need only consider what you might do (out of a very discrete list), and then pick on option to try to counter it, or if it can't think of what you might do, pick something that would work pretty well and you wouldn't expect. Much, much easier than more complex systems.

I suppose with the fleet manager you could ever assign roles to different ships (heck, perhaps just assigning roles to ships in a fleet would be sufficient). Assigning a ship to a defensive role, offensive, one that takes hits, etc.

I guess I'd just be happy with something that makes fleets act more like a fleet....something that makes them act organically as a unit, with different parts doing different things. Hmm, perhaps being able to assign roles to each ship is a better option overall. Though, the combat system would need to be reworked--still it would be "relatively easy" to adjust the AI to something with discrete and limited options like this (certainly compared to tactical combat).