Fighters as a Siege Frigate counter?

Actually, looking at this closer...

Siege frigates have Armor category "Light".

Bombers do damage of the type ANTIVERYHEAVY while Fighters do ANTILIGHT.


Checking in gameplay.constants...

DamagePercentBonus:ANTIVERYHEAVY:Light 0.5

Hmm, so it looks like Bombers do half listed damage vs siege frigates...

DamagePercentBonus:ANTILIGHT:Light 2.0

...while fighters do double their listed damage.

That just might be significant

Okay. I don't know if anyone cares, but I've done the (rough) math, and as far as I can tell, fighters may kill Siege Frigs *TWICE* as fast as bombers.

Rough calc:

Bomber: 44.4 damage / 13.5 seconds with 50% damage vs Light armor = 1.644 damage per second.

Fighter: 19.5 damage / 12 seconds with 200% damage vs Light armor = 3.25

Might be a good idea to stock fighters for planetary defense

Does everything smaller than a cruiser have light-class armor?

You know, Ironclad, this might be information that wouldn't HURT to be mentioned in-game.

There are different armour types?! Why in the world isn't this listed in the game? Anyone feel like writing a short guide to this stuff? Do different weapons have different attributes against different armour, or is it ship dependent (for instance, is laser always an anti-light armour weapon, or does it depend on what ship the laser is equipped to)?

Actually, the armor class for each ship is mentioned in the manual

I paged (well, mousewheeled) through the manual and interpreted 'light' armor as being 'lighter than that enormous capital ship'. Frigates ARE basically the 'infantry' of the game. That a fighter would do more damage than a guided missile is completely contrary to what every space game before has taught us.

There is Medium armor, I know it's hard to believe :/

True, but without any clarification except for that different armor types take different damage from different weapons...

Seems I failed to notice the armour type listings in the manual, so now I at least know which ships have what kind of armour, but I still can't see any listing of what weapons/which ships are good against these armour types.

Yeah, it seems very unorthodox fighters do more damage than bombers on certain ships. Common sense would tell you otherwise.

The in-game description of fighters states that they are strong against siege frigates (among other types).

If you mouseover fighters in the Squadron Management panel, it tells you they are good against LRM and Siege frigates.

A tank might shoot through a truck entirely, but a machine gun would riddle it.

Here are the ships that deal each damage type -- the ships of the damage type being 'targeted'.

Anti-Fighter Frigates -- Fighters,Bombers

Fighters, Colony Frigates, Scouts -- Long Range Frigates, Colony Frigates, Civilians, Siege Frigates

TEC/Vasari Missile Frigates, Sova Missile Platform, Planetary Defenses -- Light Frigates

Light Frigates, Siege Frigates, Utility Cruisers -- Utility Cruisers, Anti Fighter Frigates, Carrier Cruisers

Bombers -- Heavy Cruisers, Planetary Defenses

Heavy Cruisers -- nothing

Capital Ships, Advent Beam Frigates -- Capital Ships

Guess!


These are damage MODIFIERS, mind, base damage varies.

Pfft, originally posted before 1.02


In any case, the forum is eating my html, so here's a link to a quickly whipped up table of the armor types.

To answer the question (this has been posted on a recent thread of mine) - I went for an anti-siege frigate strat from the get go, and fighters were what I went for (advent carrier, hangers with upgrade, etc). In came the siege frigates, and nothing stopped them. The first wave of siege frigates was only 7, yet they managed to totally take the planet down and get out of the system. The next wave was 19, and I just quit the game after that (note that this was AFTER the recent patch, LOL).

If you actually want to stop your planet from getting destroyed, nothing will stop that because defenses are not good enough in the game to stop anything, and it takes a long time for units to die when they are getting pounded on, even if you have capital ships pounding away. Basically, siege frigates can take the planet down before you can kill them off (their bombing of the planetary population works faster than your bombing of them). So if you're trying to stop your planet from getting killed, no, there is no counter. But I suppose you could just go and kill his planet in return, and keep rebuilding your colonies as fast as your opponent takes them down, and that would be a "counter." Not a game play mechanic I particularly care for, but I suppose some like it, so to each his own.

*sigh* Please don't try to turn this into yet another "defenses suck and siege frigs are IMBA" thread. You have plenty other topics for that, and frankly, I'm not interested in hearing it.

The intent of this was to check if fighters made a better planet defense force when it came to Siege Frigs. It appears they do, if you don't mind sacrificing effectiveness vs the broader range of targets bombers ruin.

Look, your title said "Fighters as siege frigate counter... does it work?" I thought you were some guy asking for help and input. My experience is that "no, it doesn't work," because I tried that very thing as a counter. Now, I'm not asking you to agree with that answer, however you seem perturbed that I tried to help you with an answer. I find that strange.

Bottom line - if it is your experience that fighters make good counters to siege frigates, great! I'm happy for you!

Well, apologies for not making myself clear -- I should've made it more clear that I was looking to compare fighter vs bombers for anti-siege purposes, not as a magic bullet.

Perhaps I jumped on you a bit too quickly, but really, I'm just tired of hearing much of the siege frig complaints and it looked as though you were heading in that direction (*not* what I wanted this to be about).

There is a difference between constructive criticism and ranting about supposed game imbalance. He would have welcomes the former, you've been handing out the latter.

He wanted reasoned, intelligent discussion on this topic, not yet another thread ranting about supposed imbalance.

(Edit: read above, the OP phrased it better than I did but thats what I was trying to say... more or less)

Hey Agent of Kharma, we get it, you don't like the game. Will you please go away now?

Now now, stop feeding the trolls, you'll only make them come back more! (To clarify, I'm not calling him a troll -- but neither am I not calling him a troll, if you get my drift -- I'm remonstrating this guy on his behavior towards those he considers trolls, using a jocular tone)

No. I'm not going anywhere. But I'll give you two options:

1) If you don't like my posts, then don't read them, and don't respond to them.

2) If you want to buy my copy of the game, I will be more than happy to send it to you (including the serial number). Then I will "go away" as you ask. If you are interested in this, I'd be more than happy to give you my contact information and we can discuss it further outside of this forum. But until that happens, I paid for my copy of the game, and I feel more than welcome to hang out here and post on any thread I feel like posting on, and say whatever I feel like saying. Period. Paragraph.

So... unless you are the forum police, or unless you want to engage me in the business proposition I offered, I suggest you get off my dick.

Tzzz.

Anyhow.

@ Tsed
For myself it worked better for me to have more fighters than bombers in my planet defense. 9/3 7/2 sometimes fighters only.

In a fleet i prefer to have more bombers than fighters. Actually Bombers only most of the time.

I cant really tell you figures. About fighters and bombers. But after hours and hours of play. This is what worked for me the best.

I think the stuff with siege frigadtes is overestimated. Sure i had the problems in the beginning to. But, here again after hours of play, i figured when your planet is upgraded, and u got the right research and defense, some defense vessels. And perhaps some defense support vessels nearby in case a biggy is coming. Than they are not that hard to handle. In the beginning (of your playing experience) they are frustrating, but than i was not even scared about them, or them destrying my planets anymore. And this was before the game was patched.