Criticizing the game because it's not what you think it is?

Enough!

from Sins Forums
I for one am getting oh so tired of people coming onto this forum and complaining "This game sucks because I bought it thinking it was something it's not." I've heard folks complain because "epic battles" are just one part of the overall game. I've heard people whine because there's only 20 population on a planet and how that's so unrealistic. I've heard the complaint that ships in this game don't have enough stats to them, or that the tech tree is too small and therefore the game is no fun.

I wish that folks would take a minute to inform themselves of what this game is all about as opposed to simply looking at it and forming an opinion based on what they thought the game was about. The goal of this game was to combine 4X and RTS. From what I understand the goal was NOT to provide a fleshed-out RTS or a deep 4X game, but to combine the main idea from both genres and do so in a cohesive and playable manner. And THAT is what this game is.

If you want a deep 4X game with a huge tech tree or designable ships or placeable structures then you need to go play a dedicated 4X game like GalCiv2 or MOO2.

If you want a RTS with loads of units that you can crank out from your base where you mine your resources with your peons and the point of the game is to micromanage your units to hell and back in order to win, go play a RTS; you'll like WC3 or StarCraft much better.

But if what you want is a small taste of both worlds combined then SoaSE is for you. Don't get upset because it's not the game you want it to be.

[/rant]
55,976 views 33 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top
When my wife tells me to not get upset when she goes into rant mode, that's usually a cue for a brouhaha. I totally get that vibe reading the top post, although I absolutely do not want the make-up sex in this case.

I don't think it's kosher to say what you want and then deny others their own opinion, although it's a common enough strategy in my household when someone wants to pick a fight. It just doesn't seem to me a very productive means of communication, unless you like fights.

When Galactic Civilizations III came out, people were considering the idea of having a real-time 4X game. Sometimes combining concepts to make a new concept works (creates synergy), and sometimes it doesn't.

Consider the El Dorado, the iconic pickup-truck/car out of the 1970's. It was a car with a pickup truck back. It had the wimpy suspension and low torque of a small car coupled with just enough storage space to make your friends beg you to bring over your El Dorado to help them move their apartment belongings across town. Some people loved the El Dorado, others hated it, and the result is that you can't find very many around any more these days. Of course, we have all of these crazy post-SUV "recreational trucks" that aren't quite cars but aren't really trucks either, the great grandchildren of the El Dorado.

I would humbly suggest that Sins is the El Dorado of the gaming world. I really did not think that the real-time 4X would be a workable game. Still, I went out and bought Sins, and I enjoy it enough to make the purchase worthwhile. I still believe the real-time 4X is a clunky concept, but Sins makes it work as well as could be expected, perhaps even better, given the good product support from the devs.

I would be disappointed if Sins turned out to be the final word in real-time 4X games, though. I'll have to look out of my front window: if my neighbour to the left is polishing his green Gremlin and my neighbour to the right is taking out his orange Pacer for a spin, and I have a burnt-sienna El Dorado with the plastic wood panels in my own driveway, then Sins will be the last 4X game I will ever need.
Reply #2 from Stardock Forums Top
Smart post, JdeFalconr. You bring up the fundamentally schizoid nature of Sins, which consists of two imperfectly matched components. Basically, the player is encouraged to build a vast stellar empire and conduct tactical battles at the same time. The former implies centuries of expansion and the latter unfolds in (quasi) real time. Time will tell whether this design philosophy will provide enduring satisfaction or just cognitive dissonance.

My personal preference would be a graphically buffed out version of the ten yr old game, Stars! while retaining the interstellar jump lines used by Sins and Space Empires. These, while straining physics credulity, simplify AI programming and strategy options. I'd be OK with ditching ship to ship combat all together- or coming out with a deeper tactical space game as a companion piece.

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Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top
Consider the El Dorado, the iconic pickup-truck/car out of the 1970's.


I think you mean the El Camino, but I get your drift. Great analogy. At least Sins isn't the AMC Pacer of strategy games!
Reply #4 from Stardock Forums Top
When Galactic Civilizations III came out, people were considering the idea of having a real-time 4X game. Sometimes combining concepts to make a new concept works (creates synergy), and sometimes it doesn't.


Hey, where'd you get that one? I think I'd like to get that game GC3.

Anyway, IMO 4X (very deep, layered strats) and multi-player go together like Hannah Montana and El Camino. RTS and multi is much more yummier (playable to completion online in under an hour), and done over and over. Girls and multi even better, but that's another thread.

Conclusion: the dichotomy of the 2 genres makes it very hard to resolve and integrate, leaving both sides wanting it more like what they've imagined the game to be.
Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top
Right now, Sins is not for anyone, mini-dumps make the game completely unplayable. SD/IC should get this fixed before anything else.
Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top
So you're saying that no one in the world can play SoaSE because you have issues? So even though I've never had a minidump or crash, I can't play the game? Wooow, the logic is FLAWLESS!! Glad we got that sorted out.
Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top
So you're saying that no one in the world can play SoaSE because you have issues?


Yes, if you looked at other threads, I am hardly the only one with this problem. Running the game on a high-end gaming computer, there is no reason the game should be crashing. You try playing a game, you pay $40 on, for over 4hrs just for it to continuously mini-dump every time you get to a particular point in the game. And this has happened for every game I have begun. This problem makes playing multiplayer not plausible.
Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top
I can't imagine why you would still be having problems with the game crashing, after making such a huge number of informative posts on your hardware setup and the circumstances surrounding the crash. A high end computer, you say? At a particular point, you say? Why, I'm sure they'll get right on it.
Reply #9 from Sins Forums Top

Sins of a Solar Empire is one of the poorest exuses for a first person shooter I've ever played.

Let me summarize the main problems I have with it as a FPS:

  • The "bosses" totally lack character. There is no dialog between them.
  • An utter lack of health packs around the map.
  • The game seems to try to force the player into a "third person" perspective which, clearly, demonstrates how clueless Stardock/Ironclad were about making a first person shooter.Hello, FIRST person.
  • Not a single decent jump puzzle in the game.
  • Utterly lacking in a wise cracking side kick.

I could go on but why bother. Back to the store with this one...

:)

Reply #10 from Sins Forums Top
Sins of a Solar Empire is one of the poorest exuses for a first person shooter I've ever played.
Let me summarize the main problems I have with it as a FPS:

The "bosses" totally lack character. There is no dialog between them.
An utter lack of health packs around the map.
The game seems to try to force the player into a "third person" perspective which, clearly, demonstrates how clueless Stardock/Ironclad were about making a first person shooter.Hello, FIRST person.
Not a single decent jump puzzle in the game.
Utterly lacking in a wise cracking side kick.
I could go on but why bother. Back to the store with this one...


Oh man, don't get me started. For me SoaSE has turned out to be the WORST music production software I've ever seen. Forget this, I'm going back to FruityLoops. What's the FTP site so I can upload the software back to you guys and return it?
Reply #11 from Sins Forums Top
So you're saying that no one in the world can play SoaSE because you have issues?Yes, if you looked at other threads, I am hardly the only one with this problem. Running the game on a high-end gaming computer, there is no reason the game should be crashing. You try playing a game, you pay $40 on, for over 4hrs just for it to continuously mini-dump every time you get to a particular point in the game. And this has happened for every game I have begun. This problem makes playing multiplayer not plausible.


Go troll somewhere else, please. You're deterring people without broken computers from buying the game when they could be enjoying it. as for other people with the same problem, it's called "vocal minority." ie, you dont hear people go "OMG i so DIDNT get a minidump error," every time the game works for them.
Reply #12 from Sins Forums Top

Oh man, don't get me started. For me SoaSE has turned out to be the WORST music production software I've ever seen. Forget this, I'm going back to FruityLoops. What's the FTP site so I can upload the software back to you guys and return it?

Have you guys read the Sins vs Mario Kart thread? Hilarious thread on the same topic :) I can't seem to find it :(

CommanderAdama, I couldn't agree more. Its particularly harmful because the vast majority of people don't have any problems - Sins is one of the most bug free stable games out there. Hynkel, we are aware of 2 bugs that we have control over, there is no need to post this is every thread you come across. Please read my post in the minidump thread so you understand what they are and why you likely didn't get an email back and what is being done.  The summary is that minidumps are caused by a variety of different things and most of them aren't related to Sins and those that are are being looked at for the patch and they aren't that common statistically speaking though the vocal minority would make it seem so.

Back on topic: does anyone have a link to the mario kart thread??

 

Reply #13 from Sins Forums Top
https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/304957

There you go blair.
Reply #14 from Sins Forums Top
Woot! thx. Bookmarked :)
Reply #15 from Sins Forums Top
Back on topic: does anyone have a link to the mario kart thread??



There. I have the feeling that thread still needs additional contributions.

EDIT: 1m10s too late... :D
Reply #16 from Sins Forums Top
Slow posters never win.

EDIT: 7 minutes late :(
Reply #17 from Stardock Forums Top
Slow posters never win.EDIT: 7 minutes late


LMAO!!!!!!
Reply #18 from Sins Forums Top
Regarding the "mistakes" in my previous post - I would consider them to be colourful dialogue... never underestimate the Internet for picking up on incorrect word usage. So, El Dorado --> El Camino, and GalCiv III --> GalCiv II.

I try not to let facts get in the way of my own native cleverosity.
Reply #19 from Sins Forums Top
I'm sorry I didn't notice that guy pointing a gun at your head and making you read the threads you don't like.

At least people who complain about something usually do so because there is something they would maybe like changed or improved for the better - in their opinion. If nobody ever complained about anything nothing would ever get improved on and we would all still be living in caves.

Agree or disagree with complaints but to moan about them being there to begin with? Well maybe there really is a guy with a gun...
Reply #20 from Sins Forums Top
Yeah, only stupid people would complain about Sins being a poor excuse for a 4X game and a poor excuse for an RTS game when it was advertised as a hybrid of 4X and RTS games. Silly idiots. It's even worse when they try to constructively suggest ways the game could be improved. Everyone knows the game is objectively perfect just the way it is, just ask the braindead mainstream gaming press.
Reply #21 from Sins Forums Top
So you're saying that no one in the world can play SoaSE because you have issues?Yes, if you looked at other threads, I am hardly the only one with this problem. Running the game on a high-end gaming computer, there is no reason the game should be crashing. You try playing a game, you pay $40 on, for over 4hrs just for it to continuously mini-dump every time you get to a particular point in the game. And this has happened for every game I have begun. This problem makes playing multiplayer not plausible.


Hi - your computer sucks, or you suck with computers, or both.

Installed and running flawlessly on three separate and different systems without issues.

Perhaps before you start throwing stones you should check the mirror first to find the problem.

Idiot.
Reply #22 from Sins Forums Top
Go troll somewhere else, please. You're deterring people without broken computers from buying the game when they could be enjoying it.


There is nothing wrong with my computer, its the game. I'm running it on a high-end gaming computer. I'm only sharing my own experiences with the game. I'm sure this problem doesn't happen with everyone, but from looking at other threads, I am obviously not the only one.

Hi - your computer sucks, or you suck with computers, or both.

Installed and running flawlessly on three separate and different systems without issues.

Perhaps before you start throwing stones you should check the mirror first to find the problem.

Idiot.


Nice sophisticated post there. As I said my computer definitely does not suck. A I certainly do not suck with computers. There are many other people who have the same problem.

Judging by your post, you must be a computer genius, why don't you offer a technical solution to the mini-dump?
Reply #23 from Sins Forums Top
You're pre-disposed to not accepting advice, that's apparent, so why waste my time?
Reply #24 from Sins Forums Top
I'm open to advice, but not insulting advice that you have given already. I've emailed support on the issue with save files etc., They have yet to respond. I thought the game was great until I began getting mini-dumps. I want this fixed so I can get back to playing the game.
Reply #25 from Sins Forums Top
Ok - pepsi challenge - find an old hard drive - install XP on it from scratch - install latest drivers - then install the game.

If it works - I'm right.

If it doesn't work - you're right.

Write back with your results. This is the only way to rule out your system in it's current condition as being the culprit.