how will stardock balance latecomers to the world?

from Stardock Forums

The closest similarity to this game that I can find that already exists is ogame, an online spreadsheet rts.  It was addictive and sucked away a few months of my life, but I quickly realized the futility of it.


Having joined the universe months after it had been made, I was drastically far behind and once I was past the newbie protection point cap, I kept getting smashed by people with millions of points compared to my few thousand (points were kept based on resources spent so high scores meant huge, teched up armies).  There was nothing I could do except sit idly by while I kept getting smashed to bits.  When a new universe was started, I joined but it took so much of my time to stay competitive I finally gave up on the game.


As someone very interested in Society, I'm very curious as to how these issues would be addressed.  If the bulk of the game is in the WW1 era and someone joins the game from scratch, how can they possibly compete?  I understand that only 25% of your land can be attacked, but shouldn't these newer players have the ability to expand without fear of easy annihilation? Otherwise it becomes simcity with only 3 cities and human neighbors and would quickly get boring.


I'm not suggesting that a new player should be able to single handidly overthrow the leading players, but I hope that the new players can join midway through a world and still enjoy the game, rather then having no influence on the game's outcome at all.  Maybe players starting in the WW1 era would have civil war era equipment right at the start and could ally with an empire willing to catch them up?  That way they werent drastically far behind and still had an influence on the outcome of the game, because what empire is going to pick up a newbie in medieval when it adds to the number of attackable provinces?
society
18,328 views 13 replies
Reply #1 from Stardock Forums Top

What you say happened in ogame seems just like what happened in 10six. While 10six, wasn't very similar to Society, it was a persistant online world where your areas coud be attacked at any time. I believe the reason it died was due to a major bug and exploit. The people who had played it for a long time had amassed such a huge amount of "technology" and resources that they could eliminate everything you owned (except your one safe area) overnight. The whole game was based on something called a 'jitter'. Everything in the game was a jitter, from armor and weapons to buildings and upgrades. Whenever something was destroyed it would turn back into a jitter which anyone could pickup. Anytime a new player got something of decent play value, a veteran would take it away. I loved the concept of the game, but it was ruined for me not only by the experience overpower players but also by some of flaw in it's implementation.


There will always be powergamers (even in this type of game) that have played for a long time. Hopefully Stardock will find a way for both long time players and new players to both enjoy the entirety of what Society will have to offer.

Reply #2 from Stardock Forums Top
That's a rather good example, Syneris. I happen to have played 10Six a great deal during beta, and a bit since release. Heck, I even spent some time as one of those nuisancesome ubergamers. I know exactly what you're talking about. However, 10Six did make moves to limit just that problem. They basically placed limits on the amount of stuff that could be brought on the offensive, based on the level of the defender. So a high end player could bring little more than just himself when harassing a newbie.

Now, 10Six's implementation was far from perfect. And the issues you mention were exacerbated by the game's sharp learning curve and 'winner take all, loser is screwed' gameplay. Especially since even the most entrenched vetran could find something worth taking from lowly players. There's no reason for Society to fall into these same pitfalls.


--LordPixie
Multiplicity - Control multiple PCs using one keyboard and mouse
Reply #3 from Stardock Forums Top

10six is actually still alive under a new name called Project Visitor. While I'm interested in seeing what they've done to it, I'd want more info than I can find before I commit $12.50/month into it.


Only time can tell how Society will turn out, but I'll try to have faith in Stardock

Reply #4 from Stardock Forums Top

I believe I read that Society will be free to play but if you're a paying customer your society can automatically be kept competitive in the tech race, among some other perks.

I'm not sure if that means it kicks you up to a competitive level automatically or if it just means you get a baseline rate of tech advance no matter how little you log in.
Reply #5 from Stardock Forums Top
From what i gathered...Society will be broken into segments of a few months each...and at the end of the segment, the server is reset and we all start from scratch. So say you came in mid-way...consider the remaining time in the current segment as a learning time. YOu could get used to waht your doing and then when the new segment starts your set
Reply #6 from Stardock Forums Top
that does make sense since an individual Socian only lives 1 month - 3 months is several generations....maybe 1-2 hundred years. Say they live to 75 that is 225 years for 3 months. Of course war, famine, etc will play a part. If we are starting with "pre-medieval" then in 200 years we are probaly medieval if not Renaissance.
Reply #7 from Stardock Forums Top
For a world that lasts longer than three months, you could introduce the idea of generations. A like any other Socian, a player character could live three months, but in that time could form a family and produce an heir (new name, new character) that would NOT automatically inherit everything from the previous player--there could be inheritance laws regarding land, property, other assets, but experience and so on would have to be gained again. The new character could keep it interesting for the experienced gamer. (?)
Reply #8 from Stardock Forums Top
Unlike you others i would prefer a consistent world with a constant growing empire but to make a balanced newcomer system one option would be to allow them to start with buildings,a small amount of troops etc + the beginner protection. Another way at looking at the whole thing is that it may not be very profitable to attack a newbie they have less resources to steal+ you could incorporate some sort of moral penaltie if you have lets say an army of 500 men and attacking 100 men your 500 wont perform at their best thinking they will win causing larger casualties than going head to head with an equal opponent
Reply #9 from Stardock Forums Top
Having to restart every three months would be pretty irritating. Mabye every 3 months your king or whoever could die of old age and all your advisors and whoever would try and take the country in a civil war, and you as the true heir have to fight them off. The effect of the civil war would be greater the larger the empire so if you were like a 4-5 zone nation you might have like 20 soldiers revolt but if your a monster enmpire with 100 zones you could have entire sections splitting off and trying for independice. in the civil wars you might lost tech and stuff based on how intese the fighting is. That would help keep the major empires from expanding and crushing the new folks while still letting them keep much of thier progress if they can beat the AI in the civil war.

On a totatly unrealated to above idea, mabye the new folks would be considered offshoots of larger empires like some side branch of the royal family formed them and nations would get bonuses of some sort for supporting the newly formed countries. That way the more powerful people would have an incentive to help the new players but they would still have to be cautios of helping them to the point where they became a threat.
Reply #10 from Stardock Forums Top
Server resets? Oh great, one of THOSE games. Yeah, we had resets on an Ultima Online shard awhile back, and let me tell you it gets irritating and NOBODY takes the game seriously. Trade, resources, diplomacy is all a farce when you can't hold onto things. And I HOPE the Devs are looking at my post right now because I will tell you this:

Thirteen year olds can't pay that 10 dollar a month fee. And that's all your playerbase will be. SOME hardcore gamers, but for the most part you'll have a solid packing of children to entertain.
Reply #11 from Stardock Forums Top
Seriously...I would be pissed off if I worked hard at becoming one of the best on the server, then one day WHAM "so sorry, server reset, but feel free to invest more time to build it back up". At least have different types of servers, maybe some with resets, but some also that have no resets or at least strict victory conditions.
Reply #12 from Stardock Forums Top
From what I've read it seems more like a game continues until someone becomes so powerful that resistance is meaningless, then resets.
Reply #13 from Stardock Forums Top
The way I've sorta been assuming it'd work - and maybe this assumption is wrong - is that geography would protect new players. Since position in the world seems to have meaning in this world, you'd set time 0 to point A, and as the time from the start of the world increased, you'd increase the distance from point A. When a new player joins, they start at that distance from point A. So as time goes by, players start further and further from the origin point, and thus further from the players who've been there at the start. It assures that players near you will be have been playing for roughly the same length of time as you.

I don't mind occasional resets, but I do hope they happen more at the proper end of games rather than just at set lengths of time. It should happen when a player or group of players has completely and unarguably dominated the entire world, and nobody else stands a chance at opposing them.