DiogoMota

Join Date 04/2025

Reinforcements DLC - Factional Victories Suggestions

The Reinforcements DLC took the saga in the right path regarding both the Command Ships and the Factional Victories. Although a simple, small and not perfect DLC, i would say that the introduction of 6 Command Ships to each faction has achieved the goal of cementing the identity of each and enchancing the Sins 2 experience overall by going to the next level of epicness.

With that said, i felt like this goal was not achieved with the factional victories. Not only they don't reflect each factions lore and identity, but in some cases they don't make much sense at all. So i would like to give some suggestions to complete what i feel is a half job done at the moment in this matter.

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FACTIONAL VICTORIES SUGGESTIONS

TEC Enclave: this is a defensive and economy based faction, they strive to build a solar powered Super Starbase at the star. These massive solar powered starbases would work as trading centers as well as defensive powerhouses against invading empire that would ensure the Enclave economic hegemony in the entire system, causing income decay in every opposing faction until conversion to the Enclave and, basically, an economic victory. Please remove the planet cracker warheads as they have no place in the Enclave lore.

TEC Primacy: this an offensive faction and ruthless by any means necessary (allying with mercenaries, raiders and bombing civilian populations), they strive to build a solar powered Super Novalith Starcannon at the star. No planetary shield can withstand the power of a Super Novalith Starcannon capable of obliterating planets, and Primacy achieve victory by ultimatum on all of the opposing factions after 1 or 2 exploded planets. This Starcannon should be heavily defended, like a starbase filled with a defensive arsenal. Please make the Supernovalith Cannon unblockable.

Advent Reborn: this faction is all about empowering the Unity through their fleet and population whether by sacrifice or resurrection. Their Unity even allows them to recall to their homeplanet faster than light. They strive to empower the Unity by building a solar powered Teleporting Deliverance Starengine at the starbase. No advent soul is truly dead with the power of a Teleporting Deliverance Starengine and not only can it revive fleets but also, as the name implies, empower the Unity to teleport (recall) to any planet in the system. Every opposing faction surrenders to the might of a faster than light civilization after 1 or 2 teleportations. This Starengine should be heavily defended, like a starbase filled with a defensive arsenal.

Advent Wrath: this faction is all about fury, revenge and converting the minds of everyone to join and empower the Unity, or killing those that won't. They strive to build a solar powered Dominating Deliverance Starengine. Every planet will join the Unity one by one, as a Super Dominating Deliverance is capable of converting not only fleets but also planets. Every opposing faction surrenders after 1 or 2 Dominating Deliverances. Please fix the Wrath leaving the system after achieving their factional victory. This Starengine should be heavily defended, like a starbase filled with a defensive arsenal.

Vasari Exodus: this faction is all about enslaving other races and exploiting their resources while moving from system to system. They strive to build a solar powered Corestripper Starbase at the star. The Exodus would use this Super Starbase to strip enemy planets and ultimately the star to the core and leave a dark and doomed system behind, to later return to a now phantom system and strip for resources as needed. Every opposing factions surrenders after stripping 1 or 2 planets to the core. Please fix the Vasari Exodus leaving for no reason at all.

Vasari Alliance: this faction is all about surviving the menace that has threatened the Vasari for ages and restoring the once mighty Vasari Empire, and they understand that the solution may come from an alliance with the powerful TEC and Advent. They strive to end the conflict by helping TEC and Advent fulfill their ideal worlds by building a solar powered Terraformer Starbase at the star. The Alliance would use this Super Starbase to Terraform planets (literally converting Irradiated, Ice, Volcanic, etc, into Terran Planets) and providing their allies with Terran worlds suiting the needs of the Trade Order and the Advent. With no clear advantage in continuing the war and specially with the incoming 4th faction, every faction joins the Alliance after 1 or 2 successful terraformed planets, as populations and planets defect (converting to the Alliance) to thrive economically (TEC) or fulfill the homeworld prophecy (Advent) under the guidance of the mighty empire of the Vasari Alliance.

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How does this translate to gameplay:

- research requirements are needed to unlock these solar superstructures;

- give warnings to these superstructures (if factional victory enabled);

- give players time to react by having these supertructures being actually built and having a build time and charge time, instead of the current artificial 15 minute timer;

- have the AI react to such superstructures;

- allow for the players to choose whether to end the match after their superstructures are used (Factional Victory) or actually allowing each player to dominate each faction by destroying/converting enemy colonies one by one (Disabled Factional Victory, but superstructures available and playable);

- allow the players to battle it out at the star, even if supertructures are build to contest their opponents threat and have truly epic star wars with starbases, superstructures and fleets.

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Your notion of wonder-starbase-superstructures is an intriguing idea. That being said, the notion of solar powered anything is fairly silly. I'm not sure if it's a translation issue, but you probably want something more akin to the Star Forge - https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Forge

It's not sunlight powering said starbase\automated shipyard, rather it's using energy and matter drained from the star (in conjunction with Dark Side Force power?). Obviously the SoaSE universe doesn't have Force stuff, let alone Jeth or Sidi but a 'wonder-starbase-superstructure' type victory might be plausible. Perhaps a base structure with extremely slow upgrades required to complete the victory thereby forcing a star rush? Or which gives such overwhelming advantage that the game snowballs thereafter - a superstructure equivalent to a titan?

(How would this work for multi-star maps though?)

While the Primacy killing other planets (Novalith doesn't crack planets does it? Oh my bad - https://strategywiki.org/wiki/Sins_of_a_Solar_Empire_II/TEC_Ship_items#Planet_Cracker_Warheads) makes sense, why is it a problem if the Enclave 'nuke' enemy worlds? Their strategy is turtle up then wipe out external life. An economic structure simply doesn't offer a victory option. Remember, Vasari don't even use credits!

Wrath killing or mind controlling their enemies makes sense, but Reborn getting a 'teleport anywhere' power does not. Vasari are the (current) phase masters. The Reborn's teleport to the homeworld seems to challenge this. Allowing them to increase this to teleport anywhere would be grossly overpowered. Something more akin to 'resurrect for free any friendly vessel killed within range' would be more reasonable IMHO, also more consistent with the nature of the faction. There'd need to be a resurrect delay e.g. 2 minutes for frigates, 4 minutes for cruisers, and 5 minutes + 1 minute per level for capital ships, but this would force enemies to do a hammer blow to knock it out, or lose. Likewise the Wrath could simply take over planets in an expanding arc, forcing enemy forces to charge the star with their combined fleets, or lose.

While I get your Exodus Core Stripper point, I don't think it's viable. The Jarrasul Evacuator has Drain Planet as its ultimate, which is somewhat akin to https://strategywiki.org/wiki/Sins_of_a_Solar_Empire_II/Stripped_to_the_Core, just far weaker, and non-destructive. I don't see a way for the Exodus to manage the same thing on an interplanetary, or interstellar, basis. Maybe instead resurrect SoaSE 1's Kostura Cannon?

https://sinsofasolarempire.fandom.com/wiki/Kostura_Cannon

In conjunction with Tier 5's Highly Attuned Sensors which allow for every phase jump to be seen, and to know exactly what's jumped into every system, the Exodus would be able to hit fleets the moment they jump into another system, and absolutely wipe them out - unless it was a wormhole system, but even they'd be limited to the other side, the moment they phase jumped away they'd be targets again. Yes this does presuppose a Kostura that does more damage than SoaSE 1's, but that's up to the developers!

Your Alliance idea makes the least sense. Yes the Alliance want to work with TEC and Advent forces, but they're supposed to be co-equal. Building a terraformer to convert ideal Vasari (or Advent) worlds into ideal TEC worlds seems to be self sabotaging!!! And if the Alliance is selling out, then it's not a mighty empire guiding anything. How about instead a Babylon 5 type concept that allows for tech sharing between allies? If non-Alliance members are allied then relevant Enclave\Exodus\Primacy\Reborn\Wrath tech is shared amongst all allied faction. Alternatively create custom unlockable tech which empowers all the allied fleets e.g. Speed boost from Reborn for lighter materials, speed boost from Exodus due to better drives, Faster weapons from Wrath and Primacy, ... Techs should overlap so the more diversity in the allied forces, the more the power snowballs! If you have 1 ally from each faction on a 6 man team, then you get 6x the power. This should be designed to be incredibly unbalanced so as to force enemies to destroy the superstructure before the shared tech can be researched. This actually does suggest a way for your Enclave economic idea to work.

What if the Enclave superstructure were also an alliance option? Instead of simply granting a Tier 5 Pervasive Economy type personal economic boost, what if the player, and any allies gained something equivalent, but applied to all resources? And since it's about being an industrial, and economic juggernaut, what if there is a logistics boost so that the supply cap can be exceeded? Again the end result is intended to be highly unbalanced as it's intended to be game ending once it's a fully armed and operational ... oh wait, wrong universe! Given resources are typically not the issue late game - usually it seems like there's tens of thousands of credits\metal\crystal, or even hundreds of thousands piling up, ways to spend would be more of an issue. Increasing logistics would both allow for more spending, and the larger fleet size would allow for snowballing. As a slight variant, what if titan and command ship caps were doubled? This would be consistent with the Enclave as an industrial juggernaut. Allowing for 2 titans, and 6 command ships per Enclave and allied player ... Allow this as a stepped option e.g. 1 at a time, very slowly constructed modules, and pressure would grow over time to enemies who didn't work together to wipe out the structure.

The Reborn's resurrection ability could likewise be extended to allies. This would then create a clear divide:

Enclave offer logistical and maybe economic boosts to snowball a victory - pseudo-Zerg rush, Alliance offer tech upgrades to snowball a victory - power overwhelming, well stronger, faster, tougher units anyway, and Reborn offer resurrection of any units killed within their superstructure's expanding AoE. These are all team support advantages, though the Alliance should offer the most as they are alliance focused.

Conversely the Primacy simply want to blow up enemy planets, the Wrath want to mind control enemy worlds, and the Exodus, well they'd wipe out fleets then move in to seize worlds. All very individual focused.

For multi-star maps, would each star need a starbase-wonder to apply the benefits? Primacy, Wrath, Exodus, and Reborn could all be range limited. Enclave and certainly the Alliance's advantages would not be.

The current factional victory options are TEC equipping Novalith cannons with Planet Cracker Warheads ( 150,000, 40,000, 40,000, 30, 10, 10, 10) and wiping out 5 worlds, Advent equipping 3 command ships with Telepathic Amplifier ( 30,000, 50,000, 75,000, 10, 10, 5) and having them sit around a star for 15 minutes, or Vasari equipping 3 command ships with Departure Supplies ( 60,000, 48,000, 6, 6, 6, 6, 3) and likewise hanging around a star for 15 years er minutes before taking off on the next phase of the Dark Fleet's "ten-thousand year interstellar journey, allowing them to escape from war and the sinister unknown force that pursues them". Except weren't the Alliance trying to work with the TEC and Advent to avoid this? Are the Reborn also trying to get Yuri's Revenge? Isn't that the focus of the Wrath?

Diversification does seem like a good idea, but the current 3 options don't seem to quite match the alleged goals of the Enclave or Reborn, let alone the Alliance! Superstructures would also have the added advantage that they declare "we're here to stay" which would be consistent with the Alliance's goals as I understand them, and obviously the Enclave are all about digging in and protecting their territory. Reborn, they're more focused on cleaning up the Unity right?

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