A couple more complaints about the AI

When it's attacking I've hardly ever seen the AI target the constructor ships. It will target stuff being constructed fairly often, but not the constructor ship. For example, it warps in with four Disciples on a freshly acquired asteroid, which is just starting to build its first turret. By the time the Disciples cover the distance from the edge of the well to the turret, it's more than half-way built, too much for the four Disciples to kill...

When defending the AI (even as TEC) hardly ever builds repair platforms. Turrets and an occasional hangar is what I've seen, plus it loves starbases and spams them all over the place, losing constructor ships with abandon to prowling LFs...

 

13,083 views 10 replies
Reply #1 Top

Actually in Rebellion I remember the AI attacking construction frigates for the first time. Maybe not consistently but I'm almost positive it does do it.

Reply #2 Top

Agree with Goa, it happens but it's rare. At least in my experience.

Reply #3 Top

I don't know if playing a game started with AI's of different difficulty levels makes a difference, but haven't AI's that take over for players who drop in multiplayer games been different difficulty levels since Rebellion or Diplomacy?

Reply #4 Top

It has to do with armor types I believe. The ships in stock Sins don't think that constructors are a worthy target. In some mods where armor types have been heavily modified, constructors are a top priority for some ships, such as fighters.

Reply #5 Top

I truly don't understand the complaints people have about the AI.  Isn't the entire point of playing the AI to have a feckless opponent that's incapable of strategy and tactics?  The AI needs to remain AI because if it started to play like a human player, 99.9% of all Sins owners would freak out.

Reply #6 Top

Quoting DirtySanchezz, reply 5

I truly don't understand the complaints people have about the AI.  Isn't the entire point of playing the AI to have a feckless opponent that's incapable of strategy and tactics?  The AI needs to remain AI because if it started to play like a human player, 99.9% of all Sins owners would freak out.

No, it's to have an opponent capable of playing well enough for you to have a good time, even if the risk of losing is small. Having an AI difficulty that played as close to a human player as possible would be cool. It would allow people to practice meaningful games without the humiliation of losing to other people and would be a boon for players who play mods and also want a challenging game. Though yes, not everyone would want ALL the AIs to be like that.

Reply #7 Top

Quoting GoaFan77, reply 6
not everyone would want ALL the AIs to be like that.

Which is what Easy is for (even normal to an extent). I'd be happy if Easy and Normal were generic AI (i.e. not that bright) but if Hard was more human like and then Unfair be human like with a slight resource bonus or something.

Either way, I think the past has shown no matter what they do with the AI people will complain.

Reply #8 Top

In my observations of the AI attacking, it seems as though it goes after the tactical structures first, after which it'll handle shipyards (if present), then waxes the constructor frigates, and then moves on to the remaining logistical structures.  Assuming, of course, no enemy frigates/caps/etc or trade/refinery ships are present.

I think, also, after handling all the tactical structures, it also takes into account (in part) distance to target.  I've seen fleets divide up with what they attack after that point based on where they were when the last actual threat has been destroyed.

Reply #9 Top

The AI attacks my constructor frigates pretty consistently. Pirate raids in particular pretty much always kill off any constructors at the planet before they can erect a meaningful defense. They might get 1 or 2 turrets up before they're gone. This might just be the pirate flak passively targeting them with weapon banks that aren't aimed at its primary target, though. I haven't tried ordering the construction of structures far away from the pirates and the other structures in the well, which would reveal whether or not the pirates are actually focusing the constructors.

From what I've seen the AI will also move its planet bombers out of range of turrets if possible, though it rarely builds them in large enough numbers for this to matter (i.e. you have plenty of time to build a hangar w/ fighters or a few frigates to kill them).

Anyways I don't see what's wrong with the AI spamming turrets and starbases. If its fleet is outmatched it will not bother to defend planets with it, which makes sense since it cannot attempt to out-micro a human opponent. In this situation where there are not cap ships and other big ticket units for the repair platforms to focus, a blanket of turrets and a starbase is probably the most annoying static defense for you to go against. Certainly annoying for me at least, even if I can bomb the planet down outside the range of its defense, I still have to clear out most if not all of this rubbish before I can build extractors on the planet, which takes valuable time from my invasion force.

Reply #10 Top

Quoting WJC3688, reply 9

The AI attacks my constructor frigates pretty consistently. Pirate raids in particular pretty much always kill off any constructors at the planet before they can erect a meaningful defense. They might get 1 or 2 turrets up before they're gone. This might just be the pirate flak passively targeting them with weapon banks that aren't aimed at its primary target, though. I haven't tried ordering the construction of structures far away from the pirates and the other structures in the well, which would reveal whether or not the pirates are actually focusing the constructors.

Not in my experience. It's possible that the flak guns hit them if you build stuff under the pirates' nose, but if you move them away and have other stuff to keep the pirates occupied, trade ships in particular, the constructors never see any attention. I have a pair of test save games in which I've built 14 turrets while the pirates (one of those giant raids, threat level high, I think) were in the system. Constructors never got attacked. The system had one trade port.


Quoting WJC3688, reply 9

From what I've seen the AI will also move its planet bombers out of range of turrets if possible, though it rarely builds them in large enough numbers for this to matter (i.e. you have plenty of time to build a hangar w/ fighters or a few frigates to kill them).

Yes and no, but off topic so I won't elaborate here other than to say that it moves them about 90 degrees (from the planet's perspective) relative to their initial attack position, so it only works on large planets, but always fails on asteroids, which what the single-colony-ship expansion is predicated on.


Quoting WJC3688, reply 9

Anyways I don't see what's wrong with the AI spamming turrets and starbases. If its fleet is outmatched it will not bother to defend planets with it, which makes sense since it cannot attempt to out-micro a human opponent. In this situation where there are not cap ships and other big ticket units for the repair platforms to focus, a blanket of turrets and a starbase is probably the most annoying static defense for you to go against. Certainly annoying for me at least, even if I can bomb the planet down outside the range of its defense, I still have to clear out most if not all of this rubbish before I can build extractors on the planet, which takes valuable time from my invasion force.

You're assuming that he manages to build the SB, which most of the time if fails to do, the constructor dying to 6-10 LFs in a mater of seconds. IF at least it hit the deploy the moment the SB constructor comes under fire, it might stand a chance of getting something for its credits. But the AI always seem to preplan where he wants to build the SB when the SB constructor is built and it seems it never deviates from that. You just need to intercept/chase it with LFs from the factory or when it enters the grav well. I have yet to see an AI manage to build a SB I wasn't willing to let it build. (Sometimes it's useful to let it waste credits on an irrelevant SB, e.g. one not in your path to his homeworld, as the AI is quite fond of SB upgrades and those cost a lot.)