Pacov's Replay Request

Hey guys.  In our upcoming tournament (http://forums.demigodthegame.com/396231), we will be looking into providing some live commentary along with streaming video of the replays.  Currently, rawrrr and I will providing some commentary.  Anyway, I'd like to get some practice in.  Does anyone have any high quality games that are somewhat exciting that we could get a link to the replay of?  Obviously, it must be for the current version of demigod.  Anyway, a little practice commentary will go some distance in getting folks interested imo, and will likely motivate us to provide commentary for more and more games in the tourney.  Please be thoughtful of any replays you might submit as I only have so much time to dedicate to this.  The more balanced the game, the more impressive the replays will be imo.  Anyway, if you have anything, please provide a link here and give me a little info as to why you think the game was exciting.  Thanks!

 

27,986 views 81 replies
Reply #1 Top

NT

Reply #2 Top

I want a replay of Chaos Sorceror x Ravenor Alpha on Green Tooth Gorge. 

I mean. 

Reply #3 Top

I have some but will there be compatibility issues if they are older than the current release?

I think Mcshane is interested in doing them and I am as well.

 

what type of software should we use?  I was thinking fraps and an audio capture which could easily be spliced with vegas.  (if fraps cant be configured to capture audio from the mic. - havent tried that)

Reply #4 Top

you guys should test the software out on an older replay

Reply #5 Top

I have some but will there be compatibility issues if they are older than the current release?
End of quote

Yes - if the replay is not for the current version of dg it will be unplayable. 

I'm planning on figuring out the best way to handle commentary and making the video after I find a single good replay to check out :)  I appreciate any input and if one of us comes up with a good process, then perhaps we can all use that same method. 

Reply #6 Top

Quoting OMG_Jongalt26, reply 3

I think Mcshane is interested in doing them and I am as well.
End of OMG_Jongalt26's quote

 I'd have to be about 6 beers deep before I'd be a decent commentator.

Reply #7 Top

I'd have to be about 6 beers deep before I'd be a decent commentator.
End of quote

:beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer:

have 7.

Reply #8 Top

you guys should test the software out on an older replay
End of quote

do you have a good replay in mind?  I submitted a couple of fire tb games awhile back that I could do, but they aren't horribly exciting.  Not sure if there is anything on gamereplays that is worth a watch atm.  Anyway, if you have something, please provide a link and I'll check it out. 

Reply #9 Top

i'll check tonight, i dont know if i have any worthy of note since the latest patch.

Reply #10 Top

speaking of other terrible issues w/ demigod, not having reverse compatibility to watch older replays is terrible.  Another reason SC2 is win.

Reply #11 Top

Quoting 4Nana, reply 10
speaking of other terrible issues w/ demigod, not having reverse compatibility to watch older replays is terrible.  Another reason SC2 is win.
End of 4Nana's quote

SC2 isn't exactly great with backwards compatibility either. It can cause crashes and what not. Demigod won't let you do it and it crashes anyway :D

Reply #12 Top

ya it's not the best.. but the point is, it's possible, and I've never crashed doing it.  The main issue I have with it is the need to log off battle.net to watch them.

Reply #13 Top

Quoting 4Nana, reply 10
speaking of other terrible issues w/ demigod, not having reverse compatibility to watch older replays is terrible.  Another reason SC2 is win.
End of 4Nana's quote

compare blizzard to stardock, why don't we start comparing Switzerland with Afghanistan -.- topic...

Reply #14 Top

yaya I realize the stupidity.. but srsly.. one can wish

Reply #16 Top

Most games code replays as a series of commands.

How it works is that when you create the game you create a server on localhost, and the replay is buffered into a stream. As time passes, the commands are pulled out of the stream and executed.

That's the standard way to program it, and it's how it works.

In order to support playback of different versions, you have to do a few things:

Option A) store all the gamedata in the .rep file. This "bloats" replays to very large, and can have problems if the engine was changed since certain balance changes can make the replay out-of-sync of the actual game. Elemental does this with the .sav files (old saves use the unit strenghts and values of when the game was created, not the most recent patch). So, their .sav files are more than a MB.

A bloated replay is bad. Don't give me crap about 'oh but internet speeds are hella fast! What's the difference between a 2 MB file and a 300 KB file?' Well, for me, it's a ton. 5 GB monthly limit and 6 Mbps. Or unlimited and 300 Kbps. There is a difference, and most countries outside of the US do bandwidth throttling once you go over a certain limit. JS files are getting more and more bloated as shitty webdev programmers are graduating without knowing basic JS-compression techniques.

Option B) keep a backup of all the binaries, then, in the header of your .rep, you indicate the version number, and the game chooses which binary to load and run. This bloats your Program Files, which isn't a huge deal, since harddisk space is "cheap" and it doesn't make game patches any larger or smaller. However, it does add a problem where if you buy a game after it releases, say 6 months, and they have patched the game twice, the game companies have to burn the CDs with the old binaries on them. Which is odd.

In the case of downloaded games (we can dismiss bandwidth concerns in this case since if you're the type of person to download a 4 GB game, you probably don't have too much of an issue with it), you then do have to pad game downloads in the same way. Which does cost a little bit of moeny to the company itself.

Option B also becomes more and more absurd the more the game is patched. If a game has 20 patches, you have 20 binaries floating around. It's sorta nasty and it will bloat the size of a new purchase.

Even if you keep a backup, how exactly you implement it while parsing the replay becomes a problem. You can do xdelta and reinterprete the replay on the fly allowing you to greatly reduce the size of the game backups but increasing the load time of the game, you could create a game folder that you that you mount, which has the best performance but causes MASSIVE bloat. (I'm pretty sure that SC2 uses the xdelta method).

Option C) make replays actual "movies". This bloats replays to ~25 MB, but no longer requires keeping backups of anything. However, this makes sharing replays extremely difficult and therefore, this option is unfeasible.

Reversing in a replay is another thing that would take an enormous amount of engineering hours figuring out how to do, and I imagine that Blizzard has actually taken out a software patent, since I don't actually know where I would start with it, myself.

 

tl;dr Creating a replay system that supports prior versions is unwieldly and costs a large amount of engineering hours, on top of incurring other costs, or having other drawbacks. Hence why very few companies do it, espiecially since a strong replay system very, very rarely drives new sales of games. There isn't any real money in it. SC is one of the true e-sports and so having a strong replay system does drive sales. Which is why Blizzard invested in it. Money.

\thread.

Reply #17 Top

Quoting GM-McShane87, reply 15
http://www.gamereplays.org/demigod/replays.php?game=51&show=details&id=153103 here's a replay you might like to practice commentating on Pacov.  It's only a 2 vs 2 though so less action then 3 v 3 to discuss.  It's a very nice comeback from being down quite a few kills. 
End of GM-McShane87's quote

Thanks for that, McShane - I'll check that out and start looking into software.  Much appreciated. 

Reply #18 Top

jesus.. longest replay ever.. and thx for picking the one where I die like 6 times ;)  But hey.. at least I make it up later with a clutch survival spree.

 

Anyway.. I did a practice commentary of the game on that.. then realized "oh shit, I forgot you have to pay for the extended version of fraps" so... it's now :30.  Blah.  It wasn't the best anyway.. gotta figure out how to work the camera the best way possible to deal with the constant glitching of replays lol.

 

But.. if anyone has a full version of fraps that would be excellent.. otherwise I'll probably browse for a crack in the near future.  I haven't bothered to get vegas and start rendering since I don't have anything but a 30 sec clip to render, but I'm sure it can't be that hard to figure out.

p.s. Pacov, use fraps.. records voice, video, game sound, and you start / stop with a hotkey at anytime.  

Reply #19 Top

p.s. Pacov, use fraps.. records voice, video, game sound, and you start / stop with a hotkey at anytime.
End of quote

Well... I like that, but I'm going to see what I can find around for free... hopefully something. 

edit - you know who would be funny as shite doing replay commentary?  Peter.  Someone would do something silly and he would start into a rant about something.  I'd find it amusing anyway :)

Reply #20 Top

well - I'm trying out Xfire now.  Its video capture seems to work fine even in windowed mode.  I haven't hooked my mic up yet, but I believe I'll be able to broadcast. 

i get full frames per sec in "half mode", but its a little too fuzzy for my taste.  I'm guessing I'm getting around 25 fps in "full mode" - I'll probably try it in full screen mode and see if that improves performance any. 

The way these programs appear to work is that they record uncompressed video that you can edit or compress later.  Its pretty intensive too... at max settings, 30 seconds or so is about a gig.  Ideally, I'd record in full mode, then chop it up later or just compress down the size then upload to youtube or something to that effect. 

Reply #21 Top

I only need one cocktail and im an amazing commentator!!!!

Reply #22 Top

Quoting 4Nana, reply 18
jesus.. longest replay ever.. and thx for picking the one where I die like 6 times  But hey.. at least I make it up later with a clutch survival spree.

 

Anyway.. I did a practice commentary of the game on that.. then realized "oh shit, I forgot you have to pay for the extended version of fraps" so... it's now :30.  Blah.  It wasn't the best anyway.. gotta figure out how to work the camera the best way possible to deal with the constant glitching of replays lol.

 

But.. if anyone has a full version of fraps that would be excellent.. otherwise I'll probably browse for a crack in the near future.  I haven't bothered to get vegas and start rendering since I don't have anything but a 30 sec clip to render, but I'm sure it can't be that hard to figure out.

p.s. Pacov, use fraps.. records voice, video, game sound, and you start / stop with a hotkey at anytime.  
End of 4Nana's quote

awesome can't wait to hear you rawr :D

Reply #23 Top

Quoting 4Nana, reply 18
jesus.. longest replay ever.. and thx for picking the one where I die like 6 times  But hey.. at least I make it up later with a clutch survival spree.

 

Anyway.. I did a practice commentary of the game on that.. then realized "oh shit, I forgot you have to pay for the extended version of fraps" so... it's now :30.  Blah.  It wasn't the best anyway.. gotta figure out how to work the camera the best way possible to deal with the constant glitching of replays lol.

 

But.. if anyone has a full version of fraps that would be excellent.. otherwise I'll probably browse for a crack in the near future.  I haven't bothered to get vegas and start rendering since I don't have anything but a 30 sec clip to render, but I'm sure it can't be that hard to figure out.

p.s. Pacov, use fraps.. records voice, video, game sound, and you start / stop with a hotkey at anytime.  
End of 4Nana's quote

I sent a copy of Frapps to your hotmail address.  As long as you have windows 7 ultimate 64 bit it should install and work fine, did for me anyway.  But tryingto make a DG video just owned my little ultraportable laptop's cpu, so hopefully you got a nice setup. 

And yea that game was crazy, even though you died if it wasn't for you selling stuff to get reinforcements and still being serviceable in fights we would've been screwed.  The Orb was money, Orb is always money.

Reply #24 Top

Quoting GM-McShane87, reply 15
http://www.gamereplays.org/demigod/replays.php?game=51&show=details&id=153103 here's a replay you might like to practice commentating on Pacov.  It's only a 2 vs 2 though so less action then 3 v 3 to discuss.  It's a very nice comeback from being down quite a few kills. 
End of GM-McShane87's quote

Yeah this was probably the last good game I played in. A few miss communications turned the game around.

Reply #25 Top

Quoting OMG_ZEX, reply 24

Yeah this was probably the last good game I played in. A few miss communications turned the game around.
End of OMG_ZEX's quote

should have gotten mageslayer at some point. it was unnecesarry to stack so much more of the other hp items with your no spit ub. at one point you're like just hitting and hitting you still have half life and a sigil but you realize you cannot kill anyone and walk away.  Plus your enhanced attack speed with mage slayer would have been brutal. Just in this case and this case only ooze beast would come ahead spit beast because late late late game spells become worthless and it's all about physical damage.