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chazzie

Join Date 03/2006

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An idea for the Universal Translator. (for TA)

Considering the late beta of TA at the moment it might be way to late to suggest this, but here goes.

Since all races now have their own tech tree why not do away with the universal translator altogether? insted - why not have race languages seperate?
You could then research the language you wish to learn - ie, I want to learn 'Drath' but I don't care about learning 'Drengi' and so on. This could also control trade ablities as well.

In many cases this would make each race even more unique, another idea is that Terrans don't need to learn Altarian as they have already been in communication, Drengi don't need to learn Korath as they are the same race.
Another idea would be if the Yor use a binary lanquage and say the Drath use symbols, this would then make language a valuable trade tech as well.

For me, communication as been the biggest flaw in gal civ - it works, but does not feel right, my reasons for saying this is that if enemy has researched the UT it works for just them and not for both parties and somebody talking to you before you've researched the UT.
The only real flaw that I could see with this is the Unitied Planets, all races would have to understand each other in order to vote, and I think this would ruin it a bit - having said that, UP assumes that you have the UT anyway!

What do you think?

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The head of the UP could have a UT and thus dol out the question and announce the answer.

In the feel of sci-fi I have to vote for the UT as it transcends modern needs to memorize various languages.

As for the issue of why can't you initiate comms with a race /o a UT, but you can to a race w/o it....none the less, the UT will be the mediator connecting the two races so they understand. If you speak french and I speak spanish, I have a UT and you don't, I'll hear you in spanish and you'll hear me in french.

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I like Chazzie's idea. It seems there isnt much of a bond between civs. I feel that an enemy you don’t understand may bring more of a hatred of them (you can also have a negative bonus in relations if you don’t understand them).
On the contrary this will make you feel closer to other civs that you understand (also gaining a positive bonus in relations for understanding their language).

I would like to see more ways you can bond with other civs or use them for other 'advantages' then trade and income. I think the civs need more personality or a way to get to know them better, kind of like star control where each civ your friend with grants you bonuses i.e. Shofixti's gave cheap personnel.

Guess I running off on a tangent but it would be nice to bring the allied civs closer and make the enemies more hated.

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Perhaps there should be 2 lines of techs:

The current Universal Translator, perhaps with some generic 'Xeno Relations' types of techs after it.

And a new line, maybe something like 'Xeno Linguistics' with techs under it for each race's language, and after that, culture.

The culture techs from the Xeno Linguistics line could provide more of a relations/diplomacy bonus with the race they map to, when compared with the generic Universal Translator and Xeno Relations techs.

For that matter, it may be worthwhile to make it an either/or choice similar to alignment, that way you don't need to worry about stacking the relations techs with the linguistics techs. (And figure out some way to make them non-tradable with races who chose the other path).

The logic behind this being that with a Universal Translator, your race never really got to know the other races that well. Whereas with Xeno Linguistics (AKA, tech per race language), your race has studied the other races' languages and cultures in details and better understands them.

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But then, what should the AI research if you're a custom race?

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But then, what should the AI research if you're a custom race?

Universal Translators, obviously your linguistic structure is completely incomprehensible to them.

Ok, amendment to the original plan...

2 non-exclusive research trees, Universal Translators+ Xeno Relations and Xeno Languages+Cultures:
Language and culture techs are cheap, but must be researched Per Race (and have multiple levels of stackable bonuses to diplomacy with that particular race).
UT and Relations techs are VERY expensive, and don't provide nearly as much bonus as the language techs, but apply to ALL races.

The logic? Would you be more inclined to work with a race who took the time to understand YOUR language and culture, or with a race who whips out the Cool Techno Gizmo of the month?

Another thought, maybe make the UT a trade good, that way it's a gamble going down that line, will another race build the UT before you?

Perhaps give the race that builds the UT an influence bonus?

Maybe even have multiple levels of UT techs, which start off with a diplomacy penalty and end in a moderate diplomacy bonus (to represent the fact that the first UTs weren't 100% accurate).

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Sounds interesting Atragon. Maybe studying their cultures and civilization eventually (once you complete Xeno cultures research) you can start researching their specific technologies ie. Ship design.

Once you get their ship design then maybe you can attack other civs making them think it was the civ who you stole their ship design from.... or another route can be to integrate spying into researching their culture (a spying bonus for civs you have a good understanding of, or a soldiering bonus because you know their biology better and able to attack their weak points). This way the user has the option to research their culture and use it in a benign way or in a benevolent way.

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..these are just suggestion on how to make galactic civ a more breathing and alive universe.

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One problem I see with having to research each language separately, is that some players rely on selling tech in the early turns to help fund colonizing, and then to help buffer the econ crash after the initial colonies are built.

This idea would drastically slow that process down, pushing other desperately-needed techs in the early turns further down the timeline. The current design allows finishing UT at about the point where you start meeting other races, and then you can move on to other things. I don't like the way this delays trade and diplomacy opportunities.

Another thing: it wouldn't be logically consistent to have to research just the major race languages and not the minors too. That would be a heck of a lot of languages in the average game before you could get trade and diplomacy moving. I don't see that this adds anything besides the "wouldn't it be cool if..." factor, and it might harm game mechanics that are currently working well.

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I see, maybe to counter using research time you can create a unit (scholar for example) to study the alien civ, kind of like a benign spy (gaining 'study' points per turn). This will allow the other civ the option of allowing the scholar there (on planet) or not (again modifying the relations bonus either way).

This would successfully open up the opportunities stated above.

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